Registered: Jan 2006
Location: houston, tx
Posts: 1758

Texas DOT to Install Federally Funded Highway Speed Cameras
Despite the opposition of the state legislature, the Texas Department of Transportation proposes a federally funded speed camera test.

TxDOT logoDespite the near-unanimous opposition in the state legislature to the use of speed cameras, the Texas Department of Transportation (TxDOT) is moving forward on a proposal to deploy photo radar on state highways using federal gas tax funds. Legislation awaiting Governor Rick Perry's signature prohibited only municipalities -- like Marble Falls and Rhome -- from installing automated speeding ticket systems. It was silent on the possibility of a state-run system (read legislation).

TxDOT began searching in April for a vendor that, using federal funds, would allow the agency "to assess and evaluate all elements of an automated speed notification system." Once selected, the vendor would operate an average time speed camera test for at least six months on Interstate 10 near El Paso and State Highway 6 near College Station.

Time-distance ticketing systems use multiple cameras spaced far apart on a freeway. Each car is photographed once as it enters the first section of road. Miles later a second photograph is taken that allows the vehicle's average speed to be calculated from the time it took to travel between the two locations. In use in Britain under the trade name SPECS, these cameras are commonly referred to as "yellow vultures" and are among the most lucrative in the country.

In its request for proposals, TxDOT cited success of speed cameras in the UK, which generated £120 million (US $240 million) in revenue in 2003, and in Washington, DC, which has generated $217 million in revenue with its red light and speed cameras since 1999. TxDOT's vendor will send notices -- warnings at first -- to motorists driving just 5 MPH over the limit with an accuracy level of +/- 2 MPH, meaning those driving just 3 MPH over the limit could receive a photograph and letter in the mail.

The River Cities Daily Tribune, which first reported the story last week, noted that TxDOT also ordered Marble Falls to remove its speed camera van from state highways in April citing safety concerns.

"How hypocritical is that?" Marble Falls Mayor Raymond Whitman told the Daily Tribune. "I have a bit of a problem with it, not because they're using the camera, but because if it's unsafe for us to use, how can it be safe for the state to do it?"

A full copy of the TxDOT speed camera request for proposals is available in a 219k PDF file at the source link below.

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Registered: May 2003
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 423

This shouldn't be a problem for the cowboys in Texas.

Those cameras ought to make for some good target practice!

We have Red Light Cameras popping up all over in St. Louis now. They are a pain and I think they probably cause more accidents than they prevent. Of course, one could argue that they cause "rear-ender" type collisions that are obviously less severe than "T-Bone" collisions that they supposedly help to prevent.

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Registered: Feb 2002
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Posts: 1187

quote:

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Originally posted by RacerRik
We have Red Light Cameras popping up all over in St. Louis now. They are a pain and I think they probably cause more accidents than they prevent.

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We used to have photo radar to catch speeders, but after awhile because of the public outcry, the new government scrapped it. It was a total cash grab. I hated it and was totally opposed.

However, I do believe in Red Light cameras. I just don't understand why any one needs to run a red light . Too many people see a yellow and think that it means: floor it! and we've had too many people killed from people running lights.

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Registered: May 2003
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 423

quote:

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Originally posted by Stargazer
However, I do believe in Red Light cameras. I just don't understand why any one needs to run a red light . Too many people see a yellow and think that it means: floor it! and we've had too many people killed from people running lights.

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Registered: Feb 2002
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Posts: 1187

quote:

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Originally posted by RacerRik
I agree with your sentiment on running red lights, but around here, when the light goes yellow, you probably are not going to make it through the intersection before it switches to red and the camera snaps your picture.

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We had a pretty big education campaign over here to explain to people how the red light camera's here work:

- If you are in the intersection already before it turns red, you do NOT get a ticket--i.e. You're waiting to make a left turn and the light turns red.

- If you enter the intersection on a yellow, you do NOT get a ticket. i.e. The light changes before you get a chance to finish crossing the intersection.

- If you are stopped and creep over the line into the intersection, it will NOT snap your picture.

- If you stop over the line, it will NOT snap your picture.

The ONLY times that they hand out red light tickets here is when the light is already red before you enter the intersection.

The cameras are rigged with radar so it can sense when a car is quickly approaching an intersection. When it senses that a car is going to run a red light, it snaps one picture first showing the red light and the car right before it crosses the stop line and enters the intersection.

Then it snaps a second picture that shows the car in the intersection with the red light.

Only when these two pictures clearly show that the car intersection after the light has already turned red, does a ticket get sent out.

Also, since it is an automated system (no police in attendance) it is a monetary fine only--no points/demerits, no effects on insurance. However, someone who has excessive fines may be flagged for special attention by our public insurance company.

It sounds like your area will need to go through a learning period so that everyone understands how your system works.

You may want to get a stop watch and time the yellow lights to make sure that they have not been shortened.

A guy here felt the same at one particularly busy intersection around here and found that the yellow was indeed shorter at that intersection vs. others. The news stations picked up on it and there was a total investigation and many tickets were thrown out. There was a huge public out cry and it forced officials to check every other intersection and report.

Over here it's going to be an uphill battle to re-educate people to be more attentive while they drive and to expect cars to slow down when the light turns yellow. We've got so many people here who don't, and they continue to go through when they know that the light is turning/has turned red. That's why I'm all for installing more red light cameras. (Do you want to know what's so ironic? Our gov't is so cheap that they don't load all the red light cameras with film! They rotate around the province which intersections get film! So even if you run a red light and you see flashes from the camera it doesn't mean that you're going to get a ticket .)

Anyway, making panic stops without being situationally aware of your surroundings is very risky. Especially if the person behind you is talking on their cell or having a sip of their latte or changing a CD. I'm sure people who suffer long term effects of whiplash injuries would rather not have to live with that pain.

I guess as a motorcyclist, I have to be aware of what's around me at all times and that doesn't change when I'm in a car. It bugs me because I see so many commuters not paying attention to their driving.

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Last edited by Stargazer on 07-20-2007 at 12:38 AM

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Registered: May 2003
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 423

I can't believe that these cameras use film!! I would think they would all be digital. I can also tell you that our cameras don't work like yours. I have watched people coming through the intersection when the light goes red, the cameras fire. You can easily tell because they use a tremendously bright flash when they take the picture. Now, I don't know for sure that a ticket is issued, but I don't know how someone could tell after the fact if the light was yellow when the car entered the intersection or if it red before the car got there.

As far as rear end collisions, I have had many before the cameras were installed. I have pretty much always stopped if a light turns yellow unless I am right on top of the intersection.

I have been hit pretty hard and never suffered any whiplash. I was hit so hard in one car that the stereo (which was a slide in model as used to be fashionable) actually flew out of the dash and ended up in the back seat and the mounts on the bottom of my seat broke. I didn't get hurt a bit! Seatbelts and properly adjusted headrests are your best friends in an accident!!

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Registered: Aug 2005
Location: WV
Posts: 660

Please, never, ever, have this introduced in Ohio.

Nobody knows how to drive in this state to begin with, all it will do is cause mass chaos and people will die left and right.

I'll come back after 10 years when natural selection has taken its toll.

It would be funny as hell to see it on the south side in Columbus though. People already mess with the poles and things attatched to them. The local community (for better or worse) will have busted apart those cameras before the end of the week. Especially if the locals start getting photos and bills in the mail, then they'll use firepower.

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