'05 Odyssey poor gas mileage issue

Merickson · Mar 1, 2005

I bought an "05 Odyssey last October with the EX package. It has the "ECO" feature 5 speed automatic and is rated for 20 mpg city and 28 mpg highway. After 10,000 miles (almost all highway) the best mpg I have gotten was 22 mpg. I have had the vehicle checked by the dealer and everything is working correctly. However, one of the service personel recommended that I record the gas mileage and stated that I was not the only one with this problem.

Since the "ECO" feature is new and there was no track record with it, does anyone know of more current data regarding gas mileage ratings? Also, is Honda addressing this issue in anyway?My family loves the van, but we bought it over the Toyota because of the supposed mpg and are very unhappy with our results to date.

DavidGSR · Mar 1, 2005

Try searching around the site a bit. There is one member that has a mileage tracking tool for anyone to input their data.

babylon5 · Mar 1, 2005

EX or EX-L

Is this the EX or the EX-L.
The EX has the regular VTEC rated at 18/25
The EX-L has the I-vtec rated at 20-28
(at least that's what it says on Honda.com)

If its the regualr EX the 22 isn't to far off 25.

Mommyvan · Mar 1, 2005

Dear Merickson,

The first thread listed under the '05 Ody forum talks about putting your gas mileage into this tool. If you open that thread, you can go to the third post and click on the spreadsheet that has been made so you can see how you are doing compared to everyone else. There have been people on this site who said that their dealer (or service dept.) stated that the gas mileage doesn't get better until 10K or 15K miles. I only have about 2700 miles on mine, but I'm getting about 16 mpg in the city and 23-24 mpg on the highway without the ECO engine. (My mileage is estimated at 19/25 according to the EPA.)

Best of luck to you.

Merickson · Mar 1, 2005

Thank you for the note and I am aware of the link for recording gas mileage at http://65.27.2.141/submission_form.asp. However, am really looking for more specific information as to if anything is being done to address this issue by Honda.

Regarding the EX vs. EX-L reply, mine is the EX-L. The "ECO" or Variable Cylinder Management is only on the EX-L or Touring models and that is why Honda claims the mileage will be 20/28. This was a new feature that came out w/ the '05 models and as such has no real track record to date.

Steve Pert · Mar 1, 2005

Whoa, look out.....
A post from wild willy is on its way!!

JMONTIGNY · Mar 1, 2005

I could post too about my 11.4mpg Odyssey but I decided to sell it for a Bonneville that I am sure will get much better mileage. I was very disappointed with the fuel mileage our van got.

Mommyvan · Mar 1, 2005

Merickson,

I haven't heard of anything being done by Honda on this issue. I've heard of people complaining of bad gas mileage and being laughed at by their service departments...that's about it. Part of the reason the gas mileage thread is being kept is so that people at Honda who are paying attention can see it and hopefully do something about the gas mileage problems.

I sure hope your mileage improves. Good luck to you.

Guest · Mar 1, 2005

There's also a couple of interesting posts regarding MPG test data from Consumer Reports. Basically it indicates that the MPG they experienced almost across the board for all vehicles were that:

City driving - actual fuel economy is MUCH WORSE than EPA estimate.

Highway driving - actual fuel economy is equal or slightly better than EPA estimate.

There are a lot of theories for why some vans are coming in lower than expected. (Storm, where are ya man?) Could be transmission glitches, touchy electronic throttle, or we're all overestimating how level the road is/how little AC we're using/etc.

I'm in the "touchy electronic throttle" camp. Driving the same level (known to be level because it runs alongside a river for several miles) road with or without cruise control the ECO light is a lot less steady when I'm holding speed manually. Also it's easy to forget that with the climate control on "Auto" your AC is running constantly, which will also suffer fuel economy.

Also, bear in mind that EPA ratings may not consider a fully-loaded vehicle. Probably some nominal load that's going to be less than what most of us are driving around with. (after all, if we hardly drove around with any cargo, we'd be driving tiny sedans)

--> Andy

William Wiles · Mar 1, 2005

I wouldn't expect much from the ECO feature as the EPA is only 1 mpg more than my 04. You sure won't be able to measure this in real world driving. The Odyssey is a heavy vehickle with a large engine and that computes to low mpg in start/stop and hilly driving. It takes a lot of gas to get it moving and lift it up steep hills. I just made a 3000 mile run through Florida and back to NE Ohio. I checked mpg in all the different terrains running just about all 75mph interstates. It got 21 through the mountains of W.Va. and NC. Through the flatter areas of SC and GA it ran about 24 and got 27 on the flatlands of Florida. My wife gets 19 driving around here which is mostly 35 mph and more of a rural type community. If I was driving in the city I would probably take Cabs as it would be cheaper.......

sipock97 · Mar 1, 2005

There are so many variables with fuel mileage that it would be tough to prove that something is wrong with the vehicle. We only have about 2500 on ours and have ranged from 21 to 26 on highway. If a driver,"like me" likes the feel of the peppy V6 be prepared for the low mileage. It seems that using cruise control helps on the open road. We live in a pretty flat area so that probably helps our numbers a bit.

wild willy · Mar 1, 2005

Steve P said:
Whoa, look out.....
A post from wild willy is on its way!!

Ahhhh..What's the point?

ledebuhr1 · Mar 1, 2005

I wonder how the EPA's estimates are more accurate for the gen2 Ody that the Gen3 one.

I would like to know exactly how the EPA got its 28mpg(down hill with a strong tailwind).

I know part of the reason everyone is not getting good economy is because there driving too fast.
Maybe the EPA uses old men from the VFW hall to test drive.

Guest · Mar 2, 2005

IIRC, Consumer Reports got a city of 12-13mpg and a highway of 30 mpg with an EX. I can't remember for sure, and there's too many different fuel economy threads to figure out where I posted to before.

--> Andy

macosx · Mar 2, 2005

ledebuhr1 said:
I wonder how the EPA's estimates are more accurate for the gen2 Ody that the Gen3 one.

I would like to know exactly how the EPA got its 28mpg(down hill with a strong tailwind).

I know part of the reason everyone is not getting good economy is because there driving too fast.
Maybe the EPA uses old men from the VFW hall to test drive.

Actually, Gen 2, especially the latter half (02-04) is notorious for sh*tty milage. It's not surprising that the 05 is below EPA estimates. It's a well know EPA test, and I think the manufacturers have gotten good at taking the test.

It's like the bumper test a few years back. They first tested against walls, so the bumpers were designed to be good against a wall, but performed poorly on the pole test. Then when the manufacturers knew that the pole would hit the middle of the bumper, the reinforced the middle of the bumper only. It was only after the test were done in offset crashes that these "fixes" were really exposed.

All the new cars "learn" your driving style. It would be interesting to see how the settings for the vans that were used in the EPA test would perform. I expect they would feel sluggish compared to your Ody.

I think years ago, EPA was an average, so you could expect to do a little better or worse. Now I think EPA means the MAXIMUM milage you would ever attain driving under the best of conditions.

dgipalo · Mar 2, 2005

Merickson said:
I bought an "05 Odyssey last October with the EX package. It has the "ECO" feature 5 speed automatic and is rated for 20 mpg city and 28 mpg highway. After 10,000 miles (almost all highway) the best mpg I have gotten was 22 mpg. I have had the vehicle checked by the dealer and everything is working correctly. However, one of the service personel recommended that I record the gas mileage and stated that I was not the only one with this problem.

Since the "ECO" feature is new and there was no track record with it, does anyone know of more current data regarding gas mileage ratings? Also, is Honda addressing this issue in anyway?My family loves the van, but we bought it over the Toyota because of the supposed mpg and are very unhappy with our results to date.

Some facts on fuel consumption:

1. The EPA figures are accurate if you drive the same way as the test. The test has VERY specific sequence of events, including start-up, idling, acceleration rates, braking rates. It's also run with the A/C OFF. Running A/C, running over 60 MPH, accelerating harder than EPA standards, starting with engine temps lower than the standards, etc will all result in increased consumption. Look at http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/fe_test_schedules.shtml for details of the test procedures. An abbreviated quote is:
>>>
City: Represents urban driving, in which a vehicle is started with the engine cold and driven in stop-and-go rush hour traffic. The driving cycle for the test includes idling, and the vehicle averages about 20 mph.

Highway: Represents a mixture of rural and Interstate highway driving with a warmed-up engine, typical of longer trips in free-flowing traffic. Average test speed is about 48 mph and includes no intermediate stops or idling.
<<<<
2. The EPA highway program has a relatively low peak speed, much less than the typical suburban/inter-city speeds experienced. According to the chart, they have max speed between 55 and 60 MPH in their ‘highway’ test. There have been talks about increasing that (by increasing load on the rollers to reflect the higher loads from air drag), but so far it’s just been talk.
3. We're driving bricks. Streamlined somewhat, but there is BIG frontal area in the van form factor. Also, the Cx is nothing to write home about. This will make air drag a BIG issue that becomes HUGE with increasing speed. You’ll lose a higher percentage of fuel economy with increase in speed in a van than in a typical car due to the ratio of air drag to road drag.
4. VCM will be deactivating the rear cylinders only at light engine loads. If you're driving in hilly terrain at 70+ MPH, it won’t be active much, if at all. Coupled with A/C use with defrost, or having the A/C left in ‘full auto’ will contribute to it being less active.
5. A number of areas US are using "oxygenated" fuels, the use of which results in increased consumption. The ECU is programmed to keep a specific O2 level in the exhaust gases; oxygenated fuel gets the ECU to run more fuel through the injectors.

egads · Mar 2, 2005

Merickson, how many miles on the 05? What kind of mileage do you get around town? Tires properly inflated? Many of us feel that trying to be too gentle with acceleration can actually result in worse mileage. These vans are big and heavy. 22 MPG sounds pretty good to me. No one ever gets the top rated mileage because we all drive in the real world and have to keep up with traffic. The EPA drives 55MPH on these hwy tests. When was the last time you went 55?

macosx · Mar 2, 2005

Re: Re: '05 Odyssey poor gas mileage issue

dgipalo said:
Some facts on fuel consumption:

1. The EPA figures are accurate if you drive the same way as the test. The test has VERY specific sequence of events, including start-up, idling, acceleration rates, braking rates. It's also run with the A/C OFF. Running A/C, running over 60 MPH, accelerating harder than EPA standards, starting with engine temps lower than the standards, etc will all result in increased consumption. Look at http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/fe_test_schedules.shtml for details of the test procedures. An abbreviated quote is:
>>>
City: Represents urban driving, in which a vehicle is started with the engine cold and driven in stop-and-go rush hour traffic. The driving cycle for the test includes idling, and the vehicle averages about 20 mph.

Highway: Represents a mixture of rural and Interstate highway driving with a warmed-up engine, typical of longer trips in free-flowing traffic. Average test speed is about 48 mph and includes no intermediate stops or idling.
<<<<
2. The EPA highway program has a relatively low peak speed, much less than the typical suburban/inter-city speeds experienced. According to the chart, they have max speed between 55 and 60 MPH in their ‘highway’ test. There have been talks about increasing that (by increasing load on the rollers to reflect the higher loads from air drag), but so far it’s just been talk.
3. We're driving bricks. Streamlined somewhat, but there is BIG frontal area in the van form factor. Also, the Cx is nothing to write home about. This will make air drag a BIG issue that becomes HUGE with increasing speed. You’ll lose a higher percentage of fuel economy with increase in speed in a van than in a typical car due to the ratio of air drag to road drag.
4. VCM will be deactivating the rear cylinders only at light engine loads. If you're driving in hilly terrain at 70+ MPH, it won’t be active much, if at all. Coupled with A/C use with defrost, or having the A/C left in ‘full auto’ will contribute to it being less active.
5. A number of areas US are using "oxygenated" fuels, the use of which results in increased consumption. The ECU is programmed to keep a specific O2 level in the exhaust gases; oxygenated fuel gets the ECU to run more fuel through the injectors.

Exactly what I mean by the manufacturers are good at doing the test and maximizing the numbers for the test, not for real life situations (despite what the EPA says the test is supposed to simulate).

Number 5 is particularly interesting since I assume most states that oxygenate fuel are doing it to reduce polution. BUT I just don't get how burning more fuel (if that is the result) would lead to less polution. Seems like the opposite would happen, and you wind up burning more polluting gasses.

Guest · Mar 2, 2005

It's because alcohol packs less energy per gallon than gasoline. When you replace a portion of gas with alcohol, you lose mpg. But the alcohol makes the gasoline burn cleaner.

--> Andy

wild willy · Mar 2, 2005

In all of the years I have been driving..many new cars..some used, I have never had a car that did not get or exceed what the window sticker said it would produce.

Until October of 03.....

And....9mpg??????????? That is sick..We parked next to a hummer at church the other day.....All I could do was laugh...knowing that guy was getting better mpg than I:stupid:

mejmea · Mar 2, 2005

Merickson said:
I bought an "05 Odyssey last October with the EX package. It has the "ECO" feature 5 speed automatic and is rated for 20 mpg city and 28 mpg highway. After 10,000 miles (almost all highway) the best mpg I have gotten was 22 mpg. I have had the vehicle checked by the dealer and everything is working correctly. However, one of the service personel recommended that I record the gas mileage and stated that I was not the only one with this problem.

Since the "ECO" feature is new and there was no track record with it, does anyone know of more current data regarding gas mileage ratings? Also, is Honda addressing this issue in anyway?My family loves the van, but we bought it over the Toyota because of the supposed mpg and are very unhappy with our results to date.

Merickson,

There are a number of other threads similar to this one that have a fair amount of detail about the EPA test, real world driving etc. Unfortunately my memory isn't good remember all the information there (sorry about that). I'm certain that you can find more information than you care to read via a search.

Guest · Mar 2, 2005

Re: Re: '05 Odyssey poor gas mileage issue

dgipalo said:
City: Represents urban driving, in which a vehicle is started with the engine cold and driven in stop-and-go rush hour traffic. The driving cycle for the test includes idling, and the vehicle averages about 20 mph.

My "city" driving is better than that, with avg of 28mph, and I only get 14 mpg in "pure city" driving.

inkycat · Mar 2, 2005

ECO/VCM hype

I have posted elsewhere that the VCM Odyssey has a different final drive ratio then the non VCM. This is presumably increase the RPMs so VCM has enough power to at least engage on flat or slight downhill highway. The bad part of this is that you are running at increased RPMS all the time. Notice 2300 rpm at 70 mph, my 2002 was 2000 rpm as was the 1999 (4 speed) and the non VCM 2005 Odyssey runs about 2050 rpm at 70.

Good part is less gear hunting but overall the VCM only saves gas on 65 mph flat roads --otherwise all hype.

mejmea · Mar 2, 2005

Re: ECO/VCM hype

inkycat said:
I have posted elsewhere that the VCM Odyssey has a different final drive ratio then the non VCM. This is presumably increase the RPMs so VCM has enough power to at least engage on flat or slight downhill highway. The bad part of this is that you are running at increased RPMS all the time. Notice 2300 rpm at 70 mph, my 2002 was 2000 rpm as was the 1999 (4 speed) and the non VCM 2005 Odyssey runs about 2050 rpm at 70.

Good part is less gear hunting but overall the VCM only saves gas on 65 mph flat roads --otherwise all hype.

I can't disagree about the RPMs being different, but the relationship between fuel economy and rpm isn't linear as the actual power developed (and thus fuel used) depends on the torque curve as well. I'm not saying that I know the "real world answer" since I don't have the engine curves, just that I think chalking it up to rpm differences may be oversimplified.

Guest · Mar 2, 2005

I see the eco light coming on all the time. 40mph. 30mph. Driving down residential streets. Coasting to a red light. I don't think you need to be at 65 on a freeway to put the car under "light load".

Then again, if you do, that'd explain a lot of things about your fuel economy...

--> Andy

yatesd · Mar 3, 2005

I have always had good luck with my GM vehicles meeting or exceeding EPA estimates. Perhaps the Japanese tend to engineer to this standard?

If it's any consolation, the Sienna also seems to have trouble in "real world" mileage. I have read a few reviews where actual mileage was in the teens.

I don't really watch my mileage closely, but I appear to get around 15-20 in town and 20-25 on the highway. Nothing to brag about, but not bad either....

It will be interesting to see how the Ody does after 10K on the odometer and it's first long trip. I definitely noticed a substantial increase in mileage on my last vehicle as the engine broke in.

'05 Odyssey poor gas mileage issue

Top Contributors this Month

Recommended Communities