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Cylinder 3 fouling plug

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7.4K views 39 replies 13 participants last post by  dgombert  
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#1 ·
I had my 2016 Odyssey (with 116,000 miles ) at the Honda dealership for service today to check for crummy engine performance. I have a cylinder 3 misfire. They quoted $5,200 to change rings on the #3 cylinder piston. I declined the work and I had them install a new spark plug and they say it runs fine for now. I purchased a VCM II delete kit last week. I will put it on tonight to stop the engine wanting to ever switch over to the ECO mode crap.

I plan on putting a jug of CAT A CLEAN in the gas tank tonight as a possible help, just in case the catalytic converter could be getting clogged & possible causing cylinder carbon build up. But as of now it is still not throwing a code for catalytic converter problems. I figure, the Cat A Clean can't hurt.

I will also pull cylinder #3 plug and squirt as much Berrymans B12 in the cylinder as I can and let it sit in the cylinder over the weekend. Checking it and adding more if it evaporates. Hoping that the B12 will help to loosen up any carbon on the rings.

The Honda mechanic said the rings usually get a carbon build up on them and that lets oil blow by the rings.

After the weekend, I will crank the engine (with the #3 plug removed) to get the piston to push out any remaining B12 liquid from the cylinder. Then squirt some Marvel Mystery oil in it and let the piston push it out also. Then replace the spark plug and give the engine a good old Italian tune up. i.e. drive it like hell, with hopes the engine will get up to temp, not go into ECO mode and blow the carbon from the rings.

Any other ideas for me to try ? Thanks in advance.

I wish I purchased the VCM II ECO delete device yrs ago.

This is our 3rd Odyssey over the yrs. I also have a 2010 CR-V I am not happy with Honda now.
I have a Chevy Silverado that has the variable cylinder shut off also. It will be deleted next week.
 
#2 ·
IMO what you're doing is a bit much. If you read the megathread, you'll find that you only really need to do all that in the most extreme cases. Since yours is running fine with a new spark plug you should be good to just disable the VCM and move on.
 
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#14 ·
I got the Gumout gas treatment with the PEA additive and drove the van hard, just like when I was in my teen years. It was fun. I installed the VCM II on it before I drove it. It was nice not seeing the ECO light up on the dash. The van seems to be more responsive also. Thanks for all the help, I appreciate it.
 
#15 ·
Just in case someone else searches this thread, I have news for you about Cataclean regarding the damage an unmuzzled VCM engine does to your cat converters after 150k miles or more:

  • Cataclean doesn't work
  • Cataclean won't get rid of your P0420
  • Cataclean is expensive placebo
  • Cataclean may make your intermittent P0420 a permanent P0420
  • Cataclean can't work a miracle on a blown cat with all those miles of oil fume fouling

I speak from my experience. My Ody with unmuzzled miles was throwing an intermittent P0420. I did the Cataclean thing with a hope and prayer.

Not only did my P0420 not go away, it become permanent. And to add to the pain, I also started getting a P0430.
 
O
#16 ·
Thanks for all the info. I have installed the VCM II on the van and put the Gumout cleaner product with PEA in it to a 1/2 tank of gas. I drove it hard for a while and it was great not to see the ECO light on the dash.

Will it help or hurt to add another bottle of the cleaner to my gas tank that is 1/2 full now ?

There must be a lot of people frustrated with Honda over this engine problem. I understand this is not only a problem with the Odyssey van, but other Honda vehicles also. I have been a loyal customer and this our 3rd Odyssey van over the years, and I also have a 2010 CR-V . With my disgust with the current engine problem and lack of help from Honda, except to say give up $5,400 dollars and we will re ring the piston, I don't think I will purchase another Honda product.
 
#17 ·
oldgascar said:
There must be a lot of people frustrated with Honda over this engine problem. I understand this is not only a problem with the Odyssey van, but other Honda vehicles also. I have been a loyal customer and this our 3rd Odyssey van over the years, and I also have a 2010 CR-V . With my disgust with the current engine problem and lack of help from Honda, except to say give up $5,400 dollars and we will re ring the piston, I don't think I will purchase another Honda product.
Click to expand...
My sister in law is a great example. In the mid 1980s, her young husband passed away suddenly. She had a shtbox Cavalier or something. She read about Honda and bought an Accord because she didn't have a husband to deal with the constant Chevy car problems.

She was fiercely loyal to Honda until the last few years when she had both an Accord and Pilot get the CEL and be told it needed a ring job. That was it. She moved to another brand.

I was never a Honda fan. I just got the used Odyssey as a work vehicle. I'm getting old and only have a few years left doing the handyman thing. So I bought a heavily used Ody knowing that the car wasn't perfect. This VCM thing has confirmed my old habit of not buying new Hondas. Too bad, I missed their golden years (90s.)
 
#18 ·
Meh any brand is going to have something that is an irritation or big problem- cylinder deactivation (to meet stupid EPA regs) is no different and ALL brands that use it that I know of have had some sort of issue with it at first. GM's AFM caused problems too originally, up to potential damage to the valvetrain. But Honda's VCM-3 on 2018 up seems to be lacking any real issues, GM got their AFM squared away, etc.

I get the bad taste in the mouth feel, but there really is just no golden brand. My dad had a toyota that was good (300k of oil and gas and that's it), next was really a bit of a dud with non-stop rear suspension issues and other nuisances. He got a Jeep and it has been better than that 2nd Toyota so far. Go figure.
 
#19 ·
From an outsider's perspective (i.e. I have never been a Honda fan), what I'm seeing is a lack of concern for the customer. Yes, all brands have issues. It seemed at one time Honda was really into customer concern. But this piston ring issue seems to be a "tough luck, kiddo" kind of problem. I wasn't around when the first gen Ody transmissions were blowing up, but the friends who have them said they were taken care of. What's changed since then?
 
#21 ·
Not much you can do when regulations have your hands tied. The proper thing for Honda to offer would be to program out VCM, but that is not going to happen from a legal standpoint.

Much bigger fish to fry than this IMO. Which is why I willingly bought a Honda with VCM last year.
 
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#22 ·
Yes, I agree Honda has their hands tied with regard to keeping VCM active. They cannot recommend disabling it, as it was part of the EPA numbers. Got it. For them, the only solution is ring jobs or new engines.

The problem is that engineering had a misstep here, and it has damaged Honda's reputation. People always say: "Ah, you have a Honda at 200k miles? It isn't even broken in!" Can't say that anymore.

It is baffling that they designed this knowing all the problems GM had in the previous decades. Hard to believe they couldn't see the oil burning potential. But it is what it is. I guess the lure of the strong engine was too good to ignore. I too bought my Ody knowing this going in. I love the power this engine gives, it is literally like nothing I've owned since my old early 70s Chevelle. But I'm a retired nerd who has time to play with OBDII readers, non-foulers, and the like. My sister in law knows nothing about cars except to her "New Hondas always have the check engine light on after 100k miles." That's her impression, like it or not.
 
#23 ·
They all have their issues... the point is they all have environmental and pollution crap rammed down on them, and incorporating that into vehicles is where most of the issues crop up.

Considering VCM is really the only fatal flaw with the Ody's and is easily mitigated with a technology fix.
only the naive, or (un)knowingly stupid will leave it enabled.
 
#30 ·
white2015 said:
Honestly, give the 2018s time.
The vcm systems the same. How could the outcome be different?
Click to expand...
The same reason many later VCM-2 models had fewer issues: they started programming VCM to deactivate cylinders less. Which also further confirms it's a problem. If disabling cylinders less leads to fewer problems then clearly disabling the cylinder is the cause of the problem.

Also, the Odyssey is not the first vehicle to use VCM-3. VCM-3 has been in use for 8+ years on other vehicles. None have had the engine issues. Although VCM-3 has done a number on Pilot torque converters due to induced slip.
 
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#34 ·
oldgascar said:
I had my 2016 Odyssey (with 116,000 miles ) at the Honda dealership for service today to check for crummy engine performance. I have a cylinder 3 misfire. They quoted $5,200 to change rings on the #3 cylinder piston. I declined the work and I had them install a new spark plug and they say it runs fine for now. I purchased a VCM II delete kit last week. I will put it on tonight to stop the engine wanting to ever switch over to the ECO mode crap.

I plan on putting a jug of CAT A CLEAN in the gas tank tonight as a possible help, just in case the catalytic converter could be getting clogged & possible causing cylinder carbon build up. But as of now it is still not throwing a code for catalytic converter problems. I figure, the Cat A Clean can't hurt.

I will also pull cylinder #3 plug and squirt as much Berrymans B12 in the cylinder as I can and let it sit in the cylinder over the weekend. Checking it and adding more if it evaporates. Hoping that the B12 will help to loosen up any carbon on the rings.

The Honda mechanic said the rings usually get a carbon build up on them and that lets oil blow by the rings.

After the weekend, I will crank the engine (with the #3 plug removed) to get the piston to push out any remaining B12 liquid from the cylinder. Then squirt some Marvel Mystery oil in it and let the piston push it out also. Then replace the spark plug and give the engine a good old Italian tune up. i.e. drive it like hell, with hopes the engine will get up to temp, not go into ECO mode and blow the carbon from the rings.

Any other ideas for me to try ? Thanks in advance.

I wish I purchased the VCM II ECO delete device yrs ago.

This is our 3rd Odyssey over the yrs. I also have a 2010 CR-V I am not happy with Honda now.
I have a Chevy Silverado that has the variable cylinder shut off also. It will be deleted next week.
Click to expand...
Sounds like you're covering all the bases that's a good way to do it
 
C
#35 ·
oldgascar said:
I had my 2016 Odyssey (with 116,000 miles ) at the Honda dealership for service today to check for crummy engine performance. I have a cylinder 3 misfire. They quoted $5,200 to change rings on the #3 cylinder piston. I declined the work and I had them install a new spark plug and they say it runs fine for now. I purchased a VCM II delete kit last week. I will put it on tonight to stop the engine wanting to ever switch over to the ECO mode crap.

I plan on putting a jug of CAT A CLEAN in the gas tank tonight as a possible help, just in case the catalytic converter could be getting clogged & possible causing cylinder carbon build up. But as of now it is still not throwing a code for catalytic converter problems. I figure, the Cat A Clean can't hurt.

I will also pull cylinder #3 plug and squirt as much Berrymans B12 in the cylinder as I can and let it sit in the cylinder over the weekend. Checking it and adding more if it evaporates. Hoping that the B12 will help to loosen up any carbon on the rings.

The Honda mechanic said the rings usually get a carbon build up on them and that lets oil blow by the rings.

After the weekend, I will crank the engine (with the #3 plug removed) to get the piston to push out any remaining B12 liquid from the cylinder. Then squirt some Marvel Mystery oil in it and let the piston push it out also. Then replace the spark plug and give the engine a good old Italian tune up. i.e. drive it like hell, with hopes the engine will get up to temp, not go into ECO mode and blow the carbon from the rings.

Any other ideas for me to try ? Thanks in advance.

I wish I purchased the VCM II ECO delete device yrs ago.

This is our 3rd Odyssey over the yrs. I also have a 2010 CR-V I am not happy with Honda now.
I have a Chevy Silverado that has the variable cylinder shut off also. It will be deleted next week.
Click to expand...
I've heart that the cata-clean is a good product. I just tried the royal purple in my car and it seems to be a little better now.
 
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