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Discussion Starter #1
I am wondering how often you see the new Ody on the road. My neighbor next door bought one but that's about the only one I've ever seen around Seattle area. I see a lot of the new Sienna though, I know it's about 6 months earlier to the market. Does Honda publish sales figures? How does it compare to other vans?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Here you go:
Honda Media Newsroom - Sales - Monthly Sales Reports

A snapshot for December:
Additional models with monthly sales gains included the redesigned Odyssey, up 17.4 percent to 10,147; the Pilot, up 16.7 percent to 10,337; and the Fit, up 10.3 percent to 4,860.

Mixed feelings to be honest, I don't like tons of them around :(
I quick google tells Toyota only sold 8828 Siennas last month. I guess it's only a matter of time you are going to see tons of them around.
 

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I am wondering how often you see the new Ody on the road. My neighbor next door bought one but that's about the only one I've ever seen around Seattle area. I see a lot of the new Sienna though, I know it's about 6 months earlier to the market. Does Honda publish sales figures? How does it compare to other vans?
There are a few threads on the forum that talk about the comparison between these vehicles - I probably should have taken the time to hyper-link it here, but didn't.

I actually see quite a few 2011 Odyssey's on the road here in Arizona, but I believe this is due to the relative price of the vehicle. The Odyssey is by far more expensive than the comparably equipped Sienna so since MOST people are driven by incentives and price (not cost as there is a difference) then you will see more Sienna's on the road. If I am correct the Odyssey Touring and the Sienna XLE are some $3.000/$4.000 apart in price - a vast difference if you are a price buyer. You could compare "base" models, but how many Odyssey LX models do you see sporting around (I see very few as compared to the Sienna LE). Notice too, the age of the Odyssey owner over the Sienna owner, the Odyssey is geared towards the older segment as compared to the Sienna - I read this somewhere and have noticed it myself.

Think about the incentives as well, I believe that Toyota Financial was running a 0% on all of its models this last quarter as opposed to the Honda Financial who offered 0%, but it was only on the Civic and Accord, not on the SUV/Cross-Over/Van segment.

The Odyssey is favoured by the critics, even with its higher price due to its ergonomics, cost of ownership and quality. I will say that on my recent dealer visit I observed a glut of '07-'09 Odyssey's on the used lot....
 

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I must be blind or so... as I've only seen 1 in a parking lot. And I ride a lot and spend many hours on the road. Though mostly in the suburbs, you'd think more would be in this heavily populated area?
 

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I've only seen one around town. Maybe another here or there on the interstate. Very few. And I like it that way...for now. It's nice to finally drive something a little different. But, when more maintenance is required down the road, I hope there's lots of them around. The sales figures so far suggest there will be.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I actually see quite a few 2011 Odyssey's on the road here in Arizona, but I believe this is due to the relative price of the vehicle.
Did you mean Sienna? Seem like it makes more sense after the cheaper prices and 0%.
 

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I only drive around in a limited area (a suburb south of Pittsburgh) and I've seen 3 or 4 so far. Just a handful of new Siennas too. I've been watching my dealer's inventory online and they do seem to be selling them, at least the Touring models I typically look for on their website.
 

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There are a few threads on the forum that talk about the comparison between these vehicles - I probably should have taken the time to hyper-link it here, but didn't.

I actually see quite a few 2011 Odyssey's on the road here in Arizona, but I believe this is due to the relative price of the vehicle. The Odyssey is by far more expensive than the comparably equipped Sienna so since MOST people are driven by incentives and price (not cost as there is a difference) then you will see more Sienna's on the road. If I am correct the Odyssey Touring and the Sienna XLE are some $3.000/$4.000 apart in price - a vast difference if you are a price buyer. You could compare "base" models, but how many Odyssey LX models do you see sporting around (I see very few as compared to the Sienna LE). Notice too, the age of the Odyssey owner over the Sienna owner, the Odyssey is geared towards the older segment as compared to the Sienna - I read this somewhere and have noticed it myself.

Think about the incentives as well, I believe that Toyota Financial was running a 0% on all of its models this last quarter as opposed to the Honda Financial who offered 0%, but it was only on the Civic and Accord, not on the SUV/Cross-Over/Van segment.

The Odyssey is favoured by the critics, even with its higher price due to its ergonomics, cost of ownership and quality. I will say that on my recent dealer visit I observed a glut of '07-'09 Odyssey's on the used lot....
Comparing an XLE to Touring isn't an apples to apples comparison, have to compare the XLE to a EXL which in case it's about a $2k price diff. Don't forget the Oddy has a little higher resale value than the Sienna from the calculator I saw at Edmunds.com on cost to own/depreciation, after 5yrs, the $2k price diff breaks about even if you trade vehicles every 5yrs+ or so.

Not sure I agree with the age on the Sienna vs Oddy owners.. Toyota owners on avg are older than Honda from the stats I have read.
 

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Did you mean Sienna? Seem like it makes more sense after the cheaper prices and 0%.
@jsw2233 - I mean relatively speaking. The Odyssey is more expensive upfront than the Sienna, however, I would (going by neighbours experience) believe that in the long run the Odyssey is less expensive in the greater scheme of things. My neighbour has an '03 Sienna and it quite often seems to be in the shop for one thing or the other, whereas my Odyssey has only been in for routine/annual maintenance and laid up to have the transmission replaced. I do not know his exact odometer reading, but I do know it is less than 100.000-miles as opposed to my 160.000-miles. I believe the air-conditioner has failed, water-pump, power-steering, the transmission was an issue and then some electrical gremlin.

I believe the Toyota to be a fairly acceptable vehicle, but even cosmetically the older Sienna's seem to have faded body panels, clouded head-lights, shabby interiors. But I should allow for individual/owner maintenance - however my neighbour is as fastidious about his vehicle as I am about mine and I don't have any of the above ailments.

And as for the age of an Odyssey owner; I believe I read in one of the online magazine forums that the average was 45 compared to the average age of the Sienna owner around 30. I will state that this is simply a recollection and I may be incorrect - in my area I see allot of Odyssey's driven by people without children and lets say a little gray.


When it comes to the "actual cost" of a vehicle, I believe in the Odyssey/Sienna you get what you pay for. I still have my window sticker and I spent $32.000 in 2002 for this Odyssey and have had no true repair expenses (less the transmission that the dealer covered) and the yearly "physical" that I put my vehicles through. My experience with Toyota was not as pleasant and I have witnessed others with Toyota's need miscellaneous repairs (i.e... water-pumps, power-steering....) each of those are several hundreds of dollars to repair. So in the end, you pay up front for the quality (Honda) or you pay along the way (Toyota).

Maybe we should post an age "poll" in the poll forum..... I'd be curious.
 

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Comparing an XLE to Touring isn't an apples to apples comparison, have to compare the XLE to a EXL which in case it's about a $2k price diff. Don't forget the Oddy has a little higher resale value than the Sienna from the calculator I saw at Edmunds.com on cost to own/depreciation, after 5yrs, the $2k price diff breaks about even if you trade vehicles every 5yrs+ or so.

Not sure I agree with the age on the Sienna vs Oddy owners.. Toyota owners on avg are older than Honda from the stats I have read.
@oddy03 - I understand what you are saying, I mentioned this to the "host" - I put it in "" because supposedly the comparison was being conducted by a 3rd-party research company seeking what features people preferred and their personal views of each auto maker. I spent about 20-min previewing both vehicles and felt as though the Sienna was a fully loaded model (i.e.. the funky seats, leather, DVD) and the Odyssey was a mere Touring with items that did not come on the XLE. It was also odd to me that there was no window sticker for either - the host only gave an estimated price for each which was "they are at the same price-point". I only knew what that meant due to an Economics course in college.... I believe most people would not understand that.

As for re-sale, I would have to look more closely at this but would assume as much from what you have stated. I don't care much for re-sale simply because I drive vehicles until they cost more to repair each year than what I would pay in a note. :) Which I estimate with the Odyssey will be at least another 7-years or 250.000-miles. But I see your point!
 

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@oddy03 - I understand what you are saying, I mentioned this to the "host" - I put it in "" because supposedly the comparison was being conducted by a 3rd-party research company seeking what features people preferred and their personal views of each auto maker. I spent about 20-min previewing both vehicles and felt as though the Sienna was a fully loaded model (i.e.. the funky seats, leather, DVD) and the Odyssey was a mere Touring with items that did not come on the XLE. It was also odd to me that there was no window sticker for either - the host only gave an estimated price for each which was "they are at the same price-point". I only knew what that meant due to an Economics course in college.... I believe most people would not understand that.

As for re-sale, I would have to look more closely at this but would assume as much from what you have stated. I don't care much for re-sale simply because I drive vehicles until they cost more to repair each year than what I would pay in a note. :) Which I estimate with the Odyssey will be at least another 7-years or 250.000-miles. But I see your point!
Actually I will correct myself... The oddy costs $1,975 more, but is worth $4,023 more at the end of 5 yrs, Oddy has better resale value.

At Edmunds true cost to own, After 5yrs Oddy EXL that is $34,450 is worth $18,467. Sienna XLE that is $32,475 is worth $14,444.

True, not everyone gets rid of their vehicles every 5yrs, but for those that do, the Oddy is the way to go right now.

Right now the Oddy just got a 5 star rating, the Sienna only 4 star. Another reason to buy the Oddy over the Sienna. In fact the Sienna only got 2 stars in 1 test, right front passenger, not that great. Oddy got 5 star in same scenario.
 

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I reject the notion that the Odyssey automatically is more expensive than Sienna. My benchmark for Toyotas is Fitzgerald Automall, where I bought my Camry Hybrid years ago and considered the gold standard on edmunds and other consumer sites for their upfront excellent pricing, particulary on Toyotas which they do in massive volume. Rarely, if ever, do people in my region beat Fitzmall and people fly in from all over the place to buy there.

Anyway, my apples to apples comparison is my Odyssey EXL-RES and the Sienna XLE w/Rear Entertainment. Pricing the Toyota through Fitzmall, the Odyssey I purchased was within $100. Of course, I'm one of the few on here that purchased the Odyssey at under invoice, but in the course of my shopping with a friend for the same models, we've encountered several dealers at or below invoice on 2011 Odysseys. Considering that the Sienna at that trim level has an old school radio, which makes a big difference in the dash layout and look, my Ody is worth the extra $100 in my view. The competitive advantage to the Sienna is with the larger RES in back, but it pretty much starts and ends there.
 

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I reject the notion that the Odyssey automatically is more expensive than Sienna. My benchmark for Toyotas is Fitzgerald Automall, where I bought my Camry Hybrid years ago and considered the gold standard on edmunds and other consumer sites for their upfront excellent pricing, particulary on Toyotas which they do in massive volume. Rarely, if ever, do people in my region beat Fitzmall and people fly in from all over the place to buy there.

Anyway, my apples to apples comparison is my Odyssey EXL-RES and the Sienna XLE w/Rear Entertainment. Pricing the Toyota through Fitzmall, the Odyssey I purchased was within $100. Of course, I'm one of the few on here that purchased the Odyssey at under invoice, but in the course of my shopping with a friend for the same models, we've encountered several dealers at or below invoice on 2011 Odysseys. Considering that the Sienna at that trim level has an old school radio, which makes a big difference in the dash layout and look, my Ody is worth the extra $100 in my view. The competitive advantage to the Sienna is with the larger RES in back, but it pretty much starts and ends there.
How did you get your 2011 for under invoice? They must be making up the diff on volume. Every dealer in my area wanted at least $600 over in fact some wanted MSRP for my touring I betcha they offered less on your trade in to make it appear that you got a better price on the '11 happens all the times at dealers the best I could do was about $600 over invoice and my trade was negotiated separate after the fact once I got my pricing on the '11
 

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Going back to the OP's comment on the sales volume, I too have seen far fewer Odysseys around here in northeastern NJ/metro NY than the Sienna - probably on a ratio of 4 or 5:1.

The Sienna did come to market much earlier so as more Odysseys come to the market, maybe that will even out.

I did contact our Honda dealer as my wife's lease ends mid April and we wanted to see if they were willing to eliminate the competition by buying our our lease slightly earlier and get an '11 Odyssey - they were willing to take a look at our current car and see if the value makes sense; but they also mentioned that the Touring Elite trim, which would be the one we'd want, is very rare at least in our region and they only have Touring trims in inventory for test drives. Hope that won't be a problem should my wife decide that she wants another Odyssey...
 

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How did you get your 2011 for under invoice? They must be making up the diff on volume. Every dealer in my area wanted at least $600 over in fact some wanted MSRP for my touring I betcha they offered less on your trade in to make it appear that you got a better price on the '11 happens all the times at dealers the best I could do was about $600 over invoice and my trade was negotiated separate after the fact once I got my pricing on the '11
No. First, I negotiated my deal separately (trade and new vehicle), so the price of the new vehicle (invoice minus holdback, plus $300 in accessories) was set. As far as the trade, I shopped it at CarMax and two other Honda dealers. My final trade in value was $500 over the CarMax offer. I could have done better on the trade at one of the other Honda dealers, but they were making up for it on the new car side. All I cared about was net.

I have been helping a friend get the same deal--she's gotten several quotes right around what I paid in the same market.

Now, you were shopping for a touring, and I was shopping for an EXL-RES--maybe there is an inventory difference. Although I will tell you, in the MidAtlantic, inventories are still really tight. If you want a specific color/model combo, you've got to really shop for it.

I will admit, I was pretty pleased with myself for getting the new Ody at that price, and had the satisfaction of telling several others dealers who won't work with me to stuff it afterwards. I worked hard to get that deal--I contacted nearly two dozen dealerships.
 

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No. First, I negotiated my deal separately (trade and new vehicle), so the price of the new vehicle (invoice minus holdback, plus $300 in accessories) was set. As far as the trade, I shopped it at CarMax and two other Honda dealers. My final trade in value was $500 over the CarMax offer. I could have done better on the trade at one of the other Honda dealers, but they were making up for it on the new car side. All I cared about was net.

I have been helping a friend get the same deal--she's gotten several quotes right around what I paid in the same market.

Now, you were shopping for a touring, and I was shopping for an EXL-RES--maybe there is an inventory difference. Although I will tell you, in the MidAtlantic, inventories are still really tight. If you want a specific color/model combo, you've got to really shop for it.

I will admit, I was pretty pleased with myself for getting the new Ody at that price, and had the satisfaction of telling several others dealers who won't work with me to stuff it afterwards. I worked hard to get that deal--I contacted nearly two dozen dealerships.
One thing I found at Carmax, is that in my experience, others could vary, their trade in, "buy value" is not that great and their sell prices are too high. I've been to both the Conn. and VA one.

Again, I just find it hard to believe that someone paid LESS than invoice for an 2011 Oddy, unless it was because the dealer offered more for the trade or some kind of employee discount.

Would you mind telling us which Honda dealer you paid less than invoice?
 

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Norris Honda, Dundalk, Maryland.

Basically the same deal is/was available at Heritage Honda of Parkville, MD, and Anderson Honda in Baltimore. The Baltimore market is excellent. I live in Northern Virginia, but it was well worth the trip.

In about 10 vehicle transactions, this was only the second time I've gotten a dealer to beat a CarMax offer. I had one match. My last Honda transaction, I couldn't get a dealer even to within $1000 of CarMax. It just varies.

CarMax offered right on the Black Book in this case, and the Honda offer was just slightly more. But again, I had a deal on the vehicle at that price either way. The trade was a separate transaction.
 
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