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2020 Odyssey EX-L - aftermarket speakers - amp vs no amp?

9608 Views 39 Replies 8 Participants Last post by  Deonjai
I just had a car audio installer put the Alpine s-s65c component speakers in my front right door and pillar. Turned up the radio and switched back and forth between left and right. The new speakers had no bass - like at all - even with the bass turned up to max (+6). The Alpines' rated sensitivity is 88db which is a little lower than the 90db rule of thumb when using stock head units, but both the installer and Conrad from Crutchfield said it should work great. Not sure if the head unit is just so weak (no one seems to know its true wattage) or what.

Question:
Now I'm trying to decide between getting higher sensitivity speakers or spending another $300 to get a 4 channel amp installed as well. Or just letting good enough be and keeping the stock speakers - they're not that bad... What do you all think?
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I just had a car audio installer put the Alpine s-s65c component speakers in my front right door and pillar. Turned up the radio and switched back and forth between left and right. The new speakers had no bass - like at all - even with the bass turned up to max (+6). The Alpines' rated sensitivity is 88db which is a little lower than the 90db rule of thumb when using stock head units, but both the installer and Conrad from Crutchfield said it should work great. Not sure if the head unit is...
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So you found out what we already know. For one......there is no amplifier mounted on nor inside the subwoofer enclosure. Two, there is no direct contact with bare conductors and the polyfill materials. Three polyfill is made of polyester fiber and is going to require a high temperature source of 750 deg F to begin to ignite. And finally, the enclosure is not mounted adjacent to any source of radiant heat that will bring the materials inside up to anywhere near 750.

As usual, people often say things with no basis.

Let me know when you are ready to upgrade your subwoofer enclosure. See if you can find a new 8” low profile driver that you like that is a 2 ohm unit. It doesn’t need to be a high wattage unit for this upgrade since there’s no power unit upgrade.
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
This one looks like the predecessor of the recent Pioneer, just a little lower wattage but higher sensitivity - and cheaper. Pioneer TS-SW2002D2 8-inch Shallow-Mount Subwoofer with 600 Watts Max Power

But it's frequency response is only up to 200hz, and the new model is up to 1400hz...not sure if the amp is even sending frequencies above 200 to it though, do you have any insight?

I'm gonna pick up one of these two. Doesn't seem like there are many other options that would fit anyway.
 

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Hi

The link you sent is of the exact speaker that I upgraded my enclosure with. Order that one. It works very well. When choosing a subwoofer driver you will not need a full bandwidth frequency driver. The signal going to the driver will have a filter blocking almost everything above 200 Hz anyways.

The most important thing is being able to verify that each door speaker is in phase with each other and the sub driver is 180 degrees out of phase with the door drivers.

Do you have the “speaker pop” app on your phone? You need to have something similar and. learn how to use it. You’ll have to have a test “pop” signal coming from a connection with the phone or on a flash drive with a sound file that repeats.
 

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Discussion Starter · #25 ·
Thanks Triaque.

After some more listening, I've noticed that when when a bass drum hits, the rest of the spectrum seems to get muffled... or something. A couple theories: 1) it's just a bit underpowered, and I really need an aftermarket amp to fill it out, or 2) the active noise cancellation is somehow picking up on it and interfering. Any ideas?
 

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I installed focal Pc165 in the doors of my exl with factory amp. They are 93db and I have a lot of midbass. I can't hear the factory sub and that is next to change out to the shallow pioneer. I am also putting in a audiocontrol d-6.1200 six channel Amp with dsp to fix it all. Will power 2 sets of door speakers and the upgraded sub when bridged channels 5 and 6
 

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I also did sound dampening in all the doors. If you have 88 db speakers it will not be as loud as factory. The shit factory speakers are efficient (above 90) for sure. Mine with factory amp and 93db speakers isn't any louder just better
 

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Discussion Starter · #28 ·
Thanks Triaque.

After some more listening, I've noticed that when when a bass drum hits, the rest of the spectrum seems to get muffled... or something. A couple theories: 1) it's just a bit underpowered, and I really need an aftermarket amp to fill it out, or 2) the active noise cancellation is somehow picking up on it and interfering. Any ideas?
I installed a Kicker Key DSP amp and it definitely improved the sound, but mid bass still sucked from the door speakers. It turns out that the first installer did a shoddy job and the speakers weren't secure - they could move 1/2" and were rattling around in there - and there was no foam tying them to the door or the skin. I secured them and added fast rings to seal them to the metal and the skin, and the mid bass is plenty! I suspect I could have skipped the amp, but the DSP and extra juice is still an improvement. I installed a Rockford Fosgate shallow sub on the stock amp with polyfill behind it and it tightened up the subbass quite a bit, but it's not any stronger. I've gotten a little more power out of the sub by fading the sound to the rear about 30%, allowing me to turn up the master volume another 4 or 5 ticks while keeping the overall volume the same. It does shift the sound stage back a little, but I actually prefer being immersed in the music vs having it in front of me.
 

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Do you think a little more wattage of an upgraded amp to sub will improve the sub bass. I am hoping to get a little more out of the factory sub enclosure without installing a serperate box that I can't hide. I did fast rings as well. I am glad you figured out the door speaker problem. Hard to believe an installer didn't secure them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #31 ·
If I did it over, yes, I'd probably get a 5 channel DSP amp to drive the sub as well. Could probably get a ton more thump out of that little enclosure - still only 8" but unless you're a bass head it should be plenty. I agree that the sliding door speakers are really lacking. Partly because the factory amp sends so much less volume to them, but I think mostly because they're so buried back there and it's such a large space. But I'm optimizing for the front row so it doesn't bother me much. Probably would have skipped replacing them had I known how little difference it would make, though I suspect I'd have the opposite opinion if I heard the blending of the factory speakers with the aftermarkets in the front :)
 

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You could easily add a micro mono amp to hump a little harder. They are under $100. I keep telling myself, I am spending what on a mini van. I like to drive it and we go on road trips and I like quality sound.
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
You could easily add a micro mono amp to hump a little harder. They are under $100. I keep telling myself, I am spending what on a mini van. I like to drive it and we go on road trips and I like quality sound.
Where would I put it? And would I need to run another power wire to the battery? Agreed that the quality sound makes me like driving it 2x more.
 

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Where did you put the kicker key? I would mount the sub amp behind the rear panel next to the sub. That is where I am putting the d-6.1200. Lots of room in there. You would need a power wire if you don't have one from the previous key install.
I like the $119 Skar Audio SK-M5001D on Amazon. Take the existing high level input for the sub. The sub level adjust on the head unit will still work. The factory sub amp is not up to the task. The kicker key you installed is perfect for the stereo speakers. I looked at it myself. Just one more upgrade. Will get you in the sweet spot. I am using uncle Donald's stimulus check!
Or this little dynamo
 

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all you guys wanting small form factor amp that you can easily hide... everywhere, even put it in side pockets or even in your glove box lol
look into Taramp's amp, specifically Bass 400 (it rated at 400 RMS @2ohm, but pushes 450rms, see video)
I bought it twice thinking I'll be replacing rear 8 inch sub and both times I keep changing my mind... I want 1k RMS, even then Taramp's 1200 is just few inches larger than 400 series
 

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If I did it over, yes, I'd probably get a 5 channel DSP amp to drive the sub as well. Could probably get a ton more thump out of that little enclosure - still only 8" but unless you're a bass head it should be plenty. I agree that the sliding door speakers are really lacking. Partly because the factory amp sends so much less volume to them, but I think mostly because they're so buried back there and it's such a large space. But I'm optimizing for the front row so it doesn't bother me much. Probably would have skipped replacing them had I known how little difference it would make, though I suspect I'd have the opposite opinion if I heard the blending of the factory speakers with the aftermarkets in the front :)
Hi I have a Rockford Fosgate R2-750X5 and I’m trying to connect this to my 2022 touring. I don’t know where to start can you please help.
I know how to hook up a regular amp and sub to aftermarket radio but not these
Thanks
 
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