Honda Odyssey Forum banner
21 - 40 of 46 Posts

·
Registered
2006 Honda Odyssey (EX)
Joined
·
2,748 Posts
Except for the numerous times I had to go back to the dealer in 2017 for build quality issues: fenders way out of alignment, carpeting that didn't fit, doors that wouldn't close enough to deactivate the alarm, missing body fasteners. Yep, really good build quality :rolleyes:.
Unless something has changed at the plant from previous generations to 5th generation that we don't know about, it doesn't make sense how they could suddenly have this level of incompetence. The only thing that we know changed is where it was designed.
 

·
Registered
2018 EX
Joined
·
2,132 Posts
Agreed, WiiMaster. The workers are probably as good as they always have been. It's the inspectors who need their asses kicked.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
503 Posts
Thanks again Raptor 88 and I will do as you suggest. However, I must disagree with one point you made and I will not back down. Ravishing Red or Pretty in Pink will clash big time with the silver paint color on the frame. What were you thinking!
Ha, ha. I must have had a few beers before posting the colors.

BTW, maybe consider using a pointed punch and tap a small indent into the clamp that goes around the battery's negative post in an inconspicuous place. Then you will know if the battery sensor was replaced per your request. (My friend always puts a scratch mark on the engine's oil filter before bringing his car to the dealer for an engine oil and filter change to insure that the filter was changed.) Insurance.

Raptor88
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
463 Posts
I would remove the negative chassis bolt and using a drill with a kit of 3 wire brushes and sandpaper wheel
or
sandpaper with 3 sizes of grit (the lower the number the more abrasive it is.)

make your sanding area the size of a quarter (almost always leave a 1/4" gap outside of the bolt/washer area).
If you are using sand paper use 80 first then 150 then 220 to finish it. If using the drill wire brush (my choice) use the small in-line wire brush, be sure to not press straight onto the chassis, rather at 25 to 40 degree angle around the hole, be careful in case you get the wire brush into the bolt hole as the drill will take your hand around with in a circle very quick. Now you will need some dielectric grease, this will allow the surface metals to conduct better rather than leaving it bare. From the can squirt some onto your finger and spread over the area that you removed the paint off. Apply same dielectric on bottom of and top of each conductor and apply liberally to the fastening bolt and underside the bolt head, if their is paint on the underside of the bolt and thread area. Insert the bolt and tighten it down. Now using a small paint brush or a acid brush apply more dielectric grease onto the brush and cover the entire area where you put the bolt on and the paint removal area. The reason for coating it area again is to prevent corrosion (rust) to start.


(extra small brushes for chip painting in house as I consider these to be toss away brushes after one use.

I prefer these brushes for grease work as they are small and short and you can wipe them clean when you are finished. They are not good for painting with as the hairs are way to coarse. They are generally use for applying tinning flux to clean a joint or copper pipe before soldering.
MASSIVE overthinking on this issue. Sorry, it just is.
Borrow your wifes emery boards she uses for her nails and be done with it. If youre worried about corrosion a well placed booger will do.


J/K
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,211 Posts
Borrow your wifes emery boards she uses for her nails and be done with it. If youre worried about corrosion a well placed booger will do.
Is that the best you could do? When I comment on how to do repair, I do not know the level of a persons mechanical ability or what tools or supplies they have as well. Do it simplistic, but do not use the wrong tool for the job, whoops the wrong female's hand file, not metal.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter · #26 ·
Is that the best you could do? When I comment on how to do repair, I do not know the level of a persons mechanical ability or what tools or supplies they have as well. Do it simplistic, but do not use the wrong tool for the job, whoops the wrong female's hand file, not metal.
Thanks for all the input. They finally came up with a loaner (Honda Civic) so we will see what they come up with and how long it takes. I thought about marking the battery or sensor but didn't end up doing it. The service person is trying , I believe, to find out what is happening. However, he said "oh, the Idle Stop might not work if you have the AC on Max. We didn't, but what? The design can't handle things on in the car when it shuts the engine off at a stop? We don't have an entertainment system going or any other things, but I would think any Idle Stop system would have been designed to have heated seats, entertainment, radio, AC and what not on with a battery in good condition! He then went down a rabbit hole when I mentioned it didn't appear dealerships have many cars available these days. The entire supply chain in messed up. No chips, ships waiting for 6-9 months to unload cargo in major U.S. ports and then about his centrist Republican feelings about the direction our country is heading. Not going to get a big argument from me about any of that but hey, we just need to get the loaner so you can fix the car, thank you. By the way, Driving a Civic and driving an Odyssey is like night and day! I'm 6'2 and by no means petite, but I'll take an Ody on a road trip any day over a Civic. Our first Ody had a lot of road noise but our 2020 is like being in a limo in my mind. It's especially quiet when you're just sitting there because the thing won't turn over. I will update you when I find out what they find out. For sure, I'll be improving that ground strap.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter · #27 ·
Thanks for all the input. They finally came up with a loaner (Honda Civic) so we will see what they come up with and how long it takes. I thought about marking the battery or sensor but didn't end up doing it. The service person is trying , I believe, to find out what is happening. However, he said "oh, the Idle Stop might not work if you have the AC on Max. We didn't, but what? The design can't handle things on in the car when it shuts the engine off at a stop? We don't have an entertainment system going or any other things, but I would think any Idle Stop system would have been designed to have heated seats, entertainment, radio, AC and what not on with a battery in good condition! He then went down a rabbit hole when I mentioned it didn't appear dealerships have many cars available these days. The entire supply chain in messed up. No chips, ships waiting for 6-9 months to unload cargo in major U.S. ports and then about his centrist Republican feelings about the direction our country is heading. Not going to get a big argument from me about any of that but hey, we just need to get the loaner so you can fix the car, thank you. By the way, Driving a Civic and driving an Odyssey is like night and day! I'm 6'2 and by no means petite, but I'll take an Ody on a road trip any day over a Civic. Our first Ody had a lot of road noise but our 2020 is like being in a limo in my mind. It's especially quiet when you're just sitting there because the thing won't turn over. I will update you when I find out what they find out. For sure, I'll be improving that ground strap.
UPDATE:
So 24 hours after we dropped our 2020 Ody off they had it fixed. Supposedly. They say nothing wrong with the battery or battery sensor. However, the mechanic did decide to replace the idle stop button on the dash. Said if that was faulty, (even though it showed it was disabling or enabling the idle stop system) if could affect things. Even when the car isn't running apparently, as it is tied into the starting system. Their words. Also, he said the mechanic looked at all the printed out info you all gave me and even researched a bit on this forum and decided to work on the ground strap. However, I don't see a real good job of removing the paint as I see nothing outside of the metal crimp that the bolt goes through cleaned off, and there was nothing coating the bolt to prevent rusting. So I will redo that to what I believe it should be, based on all your help.
The first thing we noticed was the Idle stop system warning message ( that it wasn't available) message came up. Service desk guy said that system won't work if the A/C is on Max and/or the engine hasn't warmed up. That doesn't fit with olur previous experience when we first got it as just out of our driveway, the thing would stop and I would be reminded that I didn't shut it off. I don't care for the feature anyway. He told me the mechanic worked a number of hours on it as he knew we were we stressed. Well, we've been very polite, but did state we didn't feel like we could go anywhere for concerned we could get stranded. He said despite all his effort they would only be paid for 1.5 hours of time spent on the car. The apple phone issue was the need to completely redo the set up after the system power loss. Again, time will tell what happens but for now we're back on the road. After a few miles and the engine temp at normal, the idle stop did seem to work. After sitting in the driveway running for a few minutes, my wife took it for a short errand and the idle stop didn't start working until after a few stops. Yup, that extended warranty out 10 years is looking like a wise investment just now.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
503 Posts
UPDATE:
So 24 hours after we dropped our 2020 Ody off they had it fixed. Supposedly. They say nothing wrong with the battery or battery sensor. ...snip...
If nothings wrong with the battery sensor, how on earth could the measured voltage be 1 volt and then jump to 12 volts, with the meter's positive lead on the battery's positive post and the negative lead on the green arrow (in the picture I posted)? The battery sensor is the only thing between the battery and the meter leads. Oh well.....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter · #29 ·
If nothings wrong with the battery sensor, how on earth could the measured voltage be 1 volt and then jump to 12 volts, with the meter's positive lead on the battery's positive post and the negative lead on the green arrow (in the picture I posted)? The battery sensor is the only thing between the battery and the meter leads. Oh well.....
Well, as I stated, Time Will Tell, right? Thanks again for everyone's imput. At least I know there is going to be a decent amount of the ground strap touching the frame.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter · #30 ·
Well, as I stated, Time Will Tell, right? Thanks again for everyone's imput. At least I know there is going to be a decent amount of the ground strap touching the frame.
Well, time did tell and yesterday my wife pulled into our driveway and while car was in drive gear, was waiting for the garage door to open and the car shut down. No power anywhere. Totally dead.
Checked the battery at terminals and it showed approximatley 12 volts, maybe 11.5. Third time being towed to dealership. First, what makes an Odyssey shut down while engine running and in drive? Not talking Stop Idle feature, total loss of any power any where in the car. Second, has anyone had any experience with the Lemon Laws. Here in Michigan, a dealership has to have 4 chances to repair the same issue before you can file some paperwork, but it's not as simple as it might sound. There are lawyers that specialize in this stuff, but it could take a year or more for a court case to evolve. We have been very fortunate that we haven't been stranded somewhere and we're getting ready for a long road trip to celebrate our 30th wedding anniv. I don't want to spend it on the side of the road! Have not heard back from the dealership on the latest tow. They had to drag the car up onto a flat bed and use wedges to try to allow the front tires to skid but I could tell the car didn't like that!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
503 Posts
Well, time did tell and yesterday my wife pulled into our driveway and while car was in drive gear, was waiting for the garage door to open and the car shut down. No power anywhere. Totally dead.
Checked the battery at terminals and it showed approximatley 12 volts, maybe 11.5. Third time being towed to dealership. First, what makes an Odyssey shut down while engine running and in drive? Not talking Stop Idle feature, total loss of any power any where in the car. Second, has anyone had any experience with the Lemon Laws. Here in Michigan, a dealership has to have 4 chances to repair the same issue before you can file some paperwork, but it's not as simple as it might sound. There are lawyers that specialize in this stuff, but it could take a year or more for a court case to evolve. We have been very fortunate that we haven't been stranded somewhere and we're getting ready for a long road trip to celebrate our 30th wedding anniv. I don't want to spend it on the side of the road! Have not heard back from the dealership on the latest tow. They had to drag the car up onto a flat bed and use wedges to try to allow the front tires to skid but I could tell the car didn't like that!
Really sorry to hear about your woes.

BTW, was the battery ever replaced? I might have missed that in this thread.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
503 Posts
No, they never replaced the battery as they said it was just fine.
Don't believe it.

As I posted in other threads, I tested the battery in our 2002 Sienna using a hydrometer. One cell was bad. When I brought the van to the Toyota dealer, after the mechanic checked it using an electronic tester, the rep said the battery was fine. I contested saying I can prove it's bad using my hydrometer. About an hour later, the Toyota rep said the battery was replaced. Power sliding door worked fine without the engine running after that.

With the seriousness of your problem, I would replace the battery (with a battery from Costco) even as a troubleshooting step.
 

·
Registered
2018 EX
Joined
·
2,132 Posts
Don't believe it.

As I posted in other threads, I tested the battery in our 2002 Sienna using a hydrometer. One cell was bad. When I brought the van to the Toyota dealer, after the mechanic checked it using an electronic tester, the rep said the battery was fine. I contested saying I can prove it's bad using my hydrometer. About an hour later, the Toyota rep said the battery was replaced. Power sliding door worked fine without the engine running after that.

With the seriousness of your problem, I would replace the battery (with a battery from Costco) even as a troubleshooting step.
👍. No question about it. New battery.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,211 Posts
No, they never replaced the battery as they said it was just fine.
All the troubleshooting offered on this site, the first thing we all forgot to mention, replace the battery, I do not know how the service department overlooked this as they have gotten so many complaints that their battery testers do no good. I skirted around the battery negative connection on the chassis and didn't think if you had replaced the battery. On the 5th Gen ODY's it not unusual to have to replace the battery from 2-3 years of age due to the charging system, short trips is the enemy of the ODY, even if you have the ODY running it will stop the engine due to the voltage not being above a certain threshold, and perhaps your is 11.5 VDC. The battery charger in this vehicle unlike generations before has the charger being controlled by a CPU in stead of a standard voltage regulator. They cycle to percentage of being more off than on to keep your alternator from putting a heavy load on your engine for fuel economy. Honda has really failed us users in this to save gas, than having a engine that has a battery fully charged. If you do a high number of short trips I would highly recommend purchasing a Noco Genius 5 battery charger, google it as the prices are all about $70. Charge your ODY overnight after 3 or 5 days of driving so it has a chance to recover your battery to a fully charged state. If you drive over 30 minutes in a single driving, you can skip that day for charging. You will have to experiment to find the right timing to charge it for your driving habits. Also please read more messages on this Forum and it will help your experience with the 5th Gen ODY! Do not go back to Honda and get their low life battery, best on the market IMHO is the Yellowtop H6 Optima battery. But only get this battery if you have a AIS button.
 

·
Registered
2018 EX
Joined
·
2,132 Posts
All the troubleshooting offered on this site, the first thing we all forgot to mention, replace the battery, I do not know how the service department overlooked this as they have gotten so many complaints that their battery testers do no good. I skirted around the battery negative connection on the chassis and didn't think if you had replaced the battery. On the 5th Gen ODY's it not unusual to have to replace the battery from 2-3 years of age due to the charging system, short trips is the enemy of the ODY, even if you have the ODY running it will stop the engine due to the voltage not being above a certain threshold, and perhaps your is 11.5 VDC. The battery charger in this vehicle unlike generations before has the charger being controlled by a CPU in stead of a standard voltage regulator. They cycle to percentage of being more off than on to keep your alternator from putting a heavy load on your engine for fuel economy. Honda has really failed us users in this to save gas, than having a engine that has a battery fully charged. If you do a high number of short trips I would highly recommend purchasing a Noco Genius 5 battery charger, google it as the prices are all about $70. Charge your ODY overnight after 3 or 5 days of driving so it has a chance to recover your battery to a fully charged state. If you drive over 30 minutes in a single driving, you can skip that day for charging. You will have to experiment to find the right timing to charge it for your driving habits. Also please read more messages on this Forum and it will help your experience with the 5th Gen ODY! Do not go back to Honda and get their low life battery, best on the market IMHO is the Yellowtop H6 Optima battery. But only get this battery if you have a AIS button.
Fully agreed.

In the old days before all this, "Let's save the planet with more fuel efficient cars, an idea that is easily negated by bloatware and unnecessary electronic toys," a voltage measurement was a true indication of a battery's condition. Today, a voltage reading at the stealership is merely a snapshot in time and is of absolutely no indication of the true condition of the battery. How the service techs don't know this fact is beyond me. Oh wait, they know this beyond a shadow of a doubt because the computer tells them there's nothing wrong with the battery 🙃!!

For my money, every car today should come with a free battery conditioner like the NOCO 5. It should be written into the manual that this device is essential to the battery's longevity and must be used on a regular basis - but wait, there's more! If Honda (and the other car makers) did that, their battery sales would plummet. Do the math.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter · #37 ·
Don't believe it.

As I posted in other threads, I tested the battery in our 2002 Sienna using a hydrometer. One cell was bad. When I brought the van to the Toyota dealer, after the mechanic checked it using an electronic tester, the rep said the battery was fine. I contested saying I can prove it's bad using my hydrometer. About an hour later, the Toyota rep said the battery was replaced. Power sliding door worked fine without the engine running after that.

With the seriousness of your problem, I would replace the battery (with a battery from Costco) even as a troubleshooting step.
HONDA ODYSSEY OWNERS BEWARE!
Ok a little dramatic I know, but have some updates. First for Raptor 88 and others who have given advice, thank you so much.
A summary. Purchased 2020 EXL last October (new) from dealer. Had minor issues but this early June, car completely shut down at a stop sign. No power anywhere. Wife started it again but after a few blocks to our home, I went out to start it and it was completely dead. Towed to dealer. Took them a couple of days to look at it but could find nothing wrong. About three weeks later, same thing. Dead in our garage. While taking a reading at battery, (showed almost no voltage) heard a click or something cycle and locks cycled and engine would start. Drove to dealer, could find nothing wrong. Changed the stop idle button on dash for kicks and giggles I guess. Nothing for a couple of months until last week. Wife pulled into driveway, car in drive gear waiting for garage door to open. Car died. No power anywhere. Had to watch while tow truck dragged car in drive gear up onto to flat bed. Front tires skidding all the way! Next day gal at dealership was checking out the car and heard noises behind the dash. Like something trying to cycle or electronic noises. By the time the mechanic got out to look at it, it started just fine. Has had it for a week and threw up his hands and scratched his head. Can't find anything wrong. FINALLY, decided to call Honda Factory Rep Tech. Their suggestions. 1, Let it run for hours to see if it will stop. They had already done that. 2, Have someone at the dealership drive it home and see if it happens to them. What! It isn't like some staff person would annalize the thing on the side of the road. They would have to have it towed back to the dealership. 3, replace the BCM. Body Control Module. They wanted to know how I wanted to proceed? Well, you have let it run, and can't see the point of staff driving it home, so replace the dang BCM. You have no other ideas. "Well, that requires that I contact our District Manager and get permission. I can only email him and sometime it has taken him a week or two to get back to me." You've got to be kidding me? So after a few days I asked if he could be emailed again. Apparently he finally decided to answer and gave permission. I thought to myself, this must really be a expensive thing if the dealership can't make the decision. So I started doing a little research since I am not a mechanic by any means.
I read that the BCM is a powerful control unit that is responsible for monitoring and controlling all other sub-computers in your car. It is in charge of managing all your automotive electronic systems such as security systems, electric locks, car lights, power mirrors, and air conditioning systems. So I thought it must be expensive. Actually, a maybe $300 retail cost. Oh, it must be really difficult to change. Nope, it's located under the console or behind the glove box in an Ody. So how long does it take to change? 60 - 90 minutes!
So the dealership has to get permission to change out a 300 dollar part that takes 60-90 minutes. That's nuts! Oh, lets see what are the symptoms of a defective body module:
Engine won't start. Problems with the locking systems or security system. Battery drain. Electrical systems not working as they should or interminnent problems and so forth. I've read a lot of you having battery drain issues and having to use a trickle charger. Then further research shows Honda this year has recalled 737,000 Pilots and Accords for bad Body Control Modules. Canada some 33,000! While not Ody's , I am sure the same manufacture makes them.
So when you are trying to figure out lot of things that might be going wrong, here is a possible solution. They may get the part in next week and so once again, we'll wait and see if we get stranded somewhere. Oh, I we discovered that the car died at a stop sign before we ever bought it and we were never informed of that. They couldn't find anything wrong, so wrote it up that they inspected for rodents and that was it! Rodents? Where do they keep these brand new cars. If this doesn't fix it, I don't know how to proceed other than a lawyer! The service tech said at this point, they are just throwing darts at it!
This is how you build customer loyalty?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Discussion Starter · #38 ·
All the troubleshooting offered on this site, the first thing we all forgot to mention, replace the battery, I do not know how the service department overlooked this as they have gotten so many complaints that their battery testers do no good. I skirted around the battery negative connection on the chassis and didn't think if you had replaced the battery. On the 5th Gen ODY's it not unusual to have to replace the battery from 2-3 years of age due to the charging system, short trips is the enemy of the ODY, even if you have the ODY running it will stop the engine due to the voltage not being above a certain threshold, and perhaps your is 11.5 VDC. The battery charger in this vehicle unlike generations before has the charger being controlled by a CPU in stead of a standard voltage regulator. They cycle to percentage of being more off than on to keep your alternator from putting a heavy load on your engine for fuel economy. Honda has really failed us users in this to save gas, than having a engine that has a battery fully charged. If you do a high number of short trips I would highly recommend purchasing a Noco Genius 5 battery charger, google it as the prices are all about $70. Charge your ODY overnight after 3 or 5 days of driving so it has a chance to recover your battery to a fully charged state. If you drive over 30 minutes in a single driving, you can skip that day for charging. You will have to experiment to find the right timing to charge it for your driving habits. Also please read more messages on this Forum and it will help your experience with the 5th Gen ODY! Do not go back to Honda and get their low life battery, best on the market IMHO is the Yellowtop H6 Optima battery. But only get this battery if you have a AIS button.
Thanks as I guess I missed your comments. What's insane to me is that I'm supposed to go out and purchase a nearly $300 battery for a car that we've had for 11 months and have put 4000 miles on! It's all under warranty and that might just void it because a Honda service rep didn't perform the work. WE have a Glass Mat Battery than is OEM and those are supposed to be superior to a normal car battery. Designed and use in the aviation industry for years. If this BCM replacement doesn't solve the issue and they have no other ideas, I will push that with them . Also, it's just hard to get over the fact (for me) that I must use a battery charger on a brand new car! Despite what you've shared, it's hard for this old school guy to believe I should have to resort to doing that. Appreciate you thoughts and maybe I'll have to be dragged screaming and kicking into doing it, but you can bet I'll be suggesting to anyone who will listen, find another car manufacturer. They all have issues , but dang!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
236 Posts
...Also, it's just hard to get over the fact (for me) that I must use a battery charger on a brand new car!...
Keep alive circuitry (security system, etc.), power sliding doors, power seats, headlights that are on after you exit the vehicle; all those things that run without the engine on draw current that's not being replaced by the alternator. Also short trips that don't fully replenish a battery will draw it down. If it sits idle for a period of time and then is run for short trips, then the battery will be slowly drained.

A good trickle or maintenance charger will help out immensely.
 

·
Registered
2018 EX
Joined
·
2,132 Posts
Despite what you've shared, it's hard for this old school guy to believe I should have to resort to doing that.
That says it all. I too am old school, which means we're talking about the power plants of the older cars that had 1/100 the electrical demands, thanks to all the electronic toys that are on these cars. Honda is not alone. They're all doing it and their day of reckoning is coming if the climate change folks have anything to say about it. The "gas engine + electronic toy store on wheels" business model is not sustainable. The move to either electric or hydrogen powered cars is coming and this change will take some pretty sophisticated engineering if consumers still insist on dragging their living rooms along for the ride. As it is, the batteries in these cars are not up to the task. And yes, they do work but not for the 6-7 year life spans we're used to. That's old school 😉!

Honda measures their successes and failures by looking at their bottom line. If they want an even truer picture, they need to get their head out of the sand and start reading true consumer feedback on this forum. As soon as they take our comments seriously, they'll see an improvement to their bottom line. For now, the will doesn't exist. It does at Yamaha. They watch their forums like a hawk and make changes and fixes according to what the consumers are saying. That's old school Japanese thinking...the very thinking that allowed them to just about slaughter the American car maker arrogance of the 70s.
 
21 - 40 of 46 Posts
Top