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Keep in mind, ISOFIX doesn't necessarily mean a better attachment than seat belts; its goal is to make a proper attachment easier to achieve.

Take the time to get the seat belt attachment right, and you're fine.

For those who want to move the car seat around a lot, ISOFIX will ultimately mean--statistically speaking--better car seat installations overall, thanks to the fact that more people stand more of a chance of getting it more right. But that won't happen for another 20 years, when ISOFIX anchors are on every car you're likely to move the car seat into.

Until then, unless you're moving your car seat around in 2002 or newer cars (2000 or newer for the German cars), you'll be using seat belts.

My solution was to get car seats for every car and take the time to install them properly and then leave them there. We also have a spare seat that's for the occasional need (that's 4 seats total for our family, including the one that's in Grandpa's car), so that we're not removing a well-installed seat just to handle Aunt Maria taking him to the park for the afternoon. We put the spare seat in her car--and may even leave it there for several days, just in case she wants to come back.

That's just an example, but you get the idea.
 

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by adam1991:
Keep in mind, ISOFIX doesn't necessarily mean a better attachment than seat belts; its goal is to make a proper attachment easier to achieve.

Take the time to get the seat belt attachment right, and you're fine.
B]</font>


Generally, I agree, but I definitely prefer LATCH attachment over the standard way.

I, probably like most on this forum like to be as anal as possible on car seat installation. Being the owner of a seatbelt only seat, a Century seat with LATCH retrofit capability, and a fully LATCH seat, I gotta say that I'll take the LATCH attachment any day (built in or even retofit). I can definitely get what I perceive is a better, tighter fit in my Ody this way. That's not to say the seat belt method is unsafe or even performs worse in any way on an engineering standpoint (I have no data to support any of my statements).

Subjectively though, the LATCH (ISOFIX) is so much easier to deal with and allows me to get the seat so solidly mounted, I truly feel it is a better system. (BTW I never move my car seats between cars) I'm a convert, and truly hope that LATCH will be more readily available on a wider range of models in the near future!

Maybe I'll swing by Japan on my way back and pick up a couple of those suckers


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Fortunately, as of 9/2002 all new carseats are required to have the LATCH attachments. All will still be compatible with seatbelt installations, too. So, the user will be able to install with whichever system is best for the vehicle.


And, as adam1991 said, in 20 years things will be much better thanks to the NHTSA. The vehicle fleet will have turned over, and current carseats should be much better than the existing generation of LATCH carseats. It may never be foolproof, but the every innovation and regulation helps to make a reduction in motor vehicle injuries even if it does take 20 years.
 

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Maybe I'm stupid, but I do not what the latch system is? Can someone please enlighten me.
 

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by indian:
...but I do not [know] what the latch system is? Can someone please enlighten me.</font>
See <a href="http://www.actsinc.org/childpass-7.html">this explanation</a> of the LATCH system.

Regards,

Maugham
 

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Would definitely agree with shindog. I'm one of those "anal" types and safety was a serious concern for me. Working with those seat belts were a laborous affair having to check and re-check the carseat for tightness. I don't think an "average" person would spend half the time I did. So this latch system is a welcome innovation.

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How is the LATCH system going to change anything about checking and re-checking for tightness? Or do you mean only at the beginning, as you're installing the seat?

That being said, I rarely had to re-do the lap-only belt on my Previa once it was latching the car seat securely. But I did check.

I do like the Mighty-Tite accessories; get it as tight as you can the normal way, then ratchet it even tighter a few notches. Give it a try. It's a great product.
 

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">How is the LATCH system going to change anything about checking and re-checking for tightness? Or do you mean only at the beginning, as you're installing the seat?</font>
Only had one car at the time and had to frequently take the car seat out in order to accomodate adult passengers.


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Discussion Starter #11
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by adam1991:
How is the LATCH system going to change anything about checking and re-checking for tightness?</font>
All the ISOFIX (LATCH) seats available in the US market now are "flexible" ISOFIX-- so checking and re-checking for tightness are still needed. However, the Japanese Honda ISOFIX seats are "rigid" ISOFIX-- that means no more checking or re-checking for tightness. (Since there is no strap-- once hooked up, those seats virtually become one part of the car. It's more like snap the removed second row seats back to the hooks on the floor.) However, most rigid type ISOFIX seats are not "universally fitting" seats. For example, European VW's rigid ISOFIX seats can only perfectly fit to new VW models and only be allowed to be used on those cars. Therefore, Honda ISOFIX seats might not be a solution for moving carseats among cars, but they surely will be a perfect fool-proofing thing...

Sid
 

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by adam1991:
I do like the Mighty-Tite accessories; get it as tight as you can the normal way, then ratchet it even tighter a few notches. Give it a try. It's a great product.</font>
If you do purchase after-market items like this one, please be advised that you use it at your own risk. Many such products claim to meet certain government standards, but these standards actually do not regulate aftermarket carseat accessories. Neither carseat nor vehicle manufacturers test or recommend such products.

Specific to this product, I note that the company and its representative were unable to address a variety of concerns with their product at a recent conference on Child Passenger Safety. These included questions about possible long term degradation to the seatbelts and the possibility of this item coming free under crash forces and becoming a dangerous projectile.

In the couple checkup events where a seat has come installed with this device, I have always been able to install it as good or better without it. In a case where that was not possible, I would personally opt for a different carseat before using an aftermarket device. I would also recommend visiting a local, certified child passenger safety technician before resorting to any aftermarket product. If they are unable to achieve a secure installation, then a parent could make a choice to try accessories which are not recommended by the carseat manufacturer. Many police departments, fire departments, hospitals and public health offices have staff trained in child passenger safety.
 

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by ody2002:
All the ISOFIX (LATCH) seats available in the US market now are "flexible" ISOFIX-- so checking and re-checking for tightness are still needed. However, the Japanese Honda ISOFIX seats are "rigid" ISOFIX-- that means no more checking or re-checking for tightness. (Since there is no strap-- once hooked up, those seats virtually become one part of the car. It's more like snap the removed second row seats back to the hooks on the floor.) However, most rigid type ISOFIX seats are not "universally fitting" seats. For example, European VW's rigid ISOFIX seats can only perfectly fit to new VW models and only be allowed to be used on those cars. Therefore, Honda ISOFIX seats might not be a solution for moving carseats among cars, but they surely will be a perfect fool-proofing thing...

Sid
</font>
I played with the Ford/Volvo rigid LATCH system for some time at a conference earlier this year. Installation was a snap, and it was very secure. The seat was pretty spartan, though it was only a late pre-production demonstrator. It also had a rear-facing cradle that went to 40 pounds. The Volvo model is supposed to be compatible with any LATCH vehicle, though obtaining the proper rear-facing recline may be a problem on some vehicles.
 

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Caviller-

I find it very hard to get a secure installation in the Ody due to the apparent need to use the locking clip. Am I wrong to assume that this is necessary? If I do not use it, then the belt moves freely through the buckle, allowing the carseat to tilt freely to near sideways. Even on the tightest install I can get this way (little to no movement front/back side/side), it will tilt.

That said, if the locking-clip is necessary, what tips can you share on getting a secure installation without resorting to helpers like Mighty-Tite? I'd love to quit using it (it's marking up the seatbelts, apparently permanently), but I don't have time to see the local carseat install specialist every time I need to put a seat in or move it.



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You shouldn't need the locking clip at all on the Ody. All you need to do is pull the seat belt all the way out to the end to engage the built-in locking mechanism, then retract the belt until the seat is tight.

With the built-in locking mechanism engaged, you'll hear the belt ratchet as you let it go back in. It'll take up all the slack and let you get it pretty darn tight.
 

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In addition to what Adam1991 said, also see the installation tips here:

http://www.car-safety.org/odyssey.html


A device like the mighty-tite is not a replacement for a locking clip, even according to its manufacturer. It does not have the capacity to take up all the slack in most seatbelts which do not have a locking mechanism like the Odyssey.

Also, a "good" carseat technician will spend the time to show you all the techniques so you can install it properly yourself each time. Sometimes at checkup events, things do get hectic and the 'instruction' unfortunately is the first thing to be omitted. If you do have an inspection, be sure to ask questions and ask to install it yourself under their supervision.
 

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adam,

Switching the seatbelt to ratchet mode doesn't prevent the belt from freely sliding through the latch.. it only keeps it from getting any longer.

So yes, I can get a pretty tight fit front/back and side/side, but since the belt can slide through the latch, the amout of belt that is going across the seat vs. up towards the B pillar is not fixed. So, the seat tilts as the belt slides through the latch.

Am I making sense?

Caviller -- thanks for the input regarding technicians.. I'll look into that. And, I'm using the mighty tite in conjunction with the locking-clip and ratchet mode on the belt.

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Discussion Starter #18
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by caviller:
I played with the Ford/Volvo rigid LATCH system for some time at a conference earlier this year. Installation was a snap, and it was very secure. The seat was pretty spartan, though it was only a late pre-production demonstrator. It also had a rear-facing cradle that went to 40 pounds. The Volvo model is supposed to be compatible with any LATCH vehicle, though obtaining the proper rear-facing recline may be a problem on some vehicles.

</font>
Speaking of that Volvo ISOFIX carseat... I've been waiting for it for more than one year. Yes, it looks like a nice design and "would fit to most cars"... But the truth is-- it's introduction date had been postponed again, again and again. It seemed that the carseat couldn't even pass Volvo's own crash tests in Europe. Volvocars had already promoted that ISOFIX seat for more than one year till they recently pulled all the Volvo ISOFIX carseat information from their websites all over the world. Now they remove that newly designed carseat's major feature, the ISOFIX bracket, and promote it as a non-ISOFIX carseat-- Well, it becomes a BIG joke for Volvocars. (Many discussions can be found on different Volvo forums.)
 
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