[ody002019]

2018 9-SP

Typically a quick Google search would result in transmission images from salvage yards. That is what I do and below is the one from a 2018 9-SPD. It is very hard to take actual images under the hood, without taking off plastic covers.

I have marked the image so you can get the orientation correctly to locate the lock shaft. Hope it helps.

View attachment 152344

Thank you!!

 

[hokie21]

Use jumper cables to get enough power to the Ody that you can shift? I'm hoping there is a better answer.

Is it possible to shift into neutral on my 2021 EX-L with a 10 speed transmission without the engine running? It appears to me that I can only shift into neutral once the car is running. The Honda Link road service guy put a portable battery pack on my car and was not able to start the car or get it into neutral without starting it. He had to drag the car onto the flatbed in Park on plastic skis he hammered under the front tires. Not a process I want to repeat.

When at the dealer I asked about this and didn't receive a very good answer. First they told me I needed a special tool (which was true with the 9 speed). Then after the technician checked their documentation and printed it out for me, it turns out the procedure is:

1. Remove Front Bulkhead Cover
2. Remove Air Intake Duct
3. Remove 12 Volt battery
4. Remove Battery Duct
5. Remove Air Cleaner
6. Remove 12 volt battery base
7. Turn the park lock release control shaft with an open-end wrench.

This is ridiculous! The tow guy doesn't have time to do all this in order to flatbed the car. It looks like this is a procedure so Honda can say "we have a procedure," but nobody is ever going to take the time to do this in an emergency situation.

I'm very disappointed that something that was so simple in my 2002 EX-L has now become totally impractical in my 2021 EX-L. I wonder why Honda doesn't think this is important any longer? They could have designed this to work a different way, if they wanted to.

 

[DJVAN]

Is it possible to shift into neutral on my 2021 EX-L with a 10 speed transmission without the engine running? It appears to me that I can only shift into neutral once the car is running. The Honda Link road service guy put a portable battery pack on my car and was not able to start the car or get it into neutral without starting it. He had to drag the car onto the flatbed in Park on plastic skis he hammered under the front tires. Not a process I want to repeat.

When at the dealer I asked about this and didn't receive a very good answer. First they told me I needed a special tool (which was true with the 9 speed). Then after the technician checked their documentation and printed it out for me, it turns out the procedure is:

1. Remove Front Bulkhead Cover
2. Remove Air Intake Duct
3. Remove 12 Volt battery
4. Remove Battery Duct
5. Remove Air Cleaner
6. Remove 12 volt battery base
7. Turn the park lock release control shaft with an open-end wrench.

This is ridiculous! The tow guy doesn't have time to do all this in order to flatbed the car. It looks like this is a procedure so Honda can say "we have a procedure," but nobody is ever going to take the time to do this in an emergency situation.

I'm very disappointed that something that was so simple in my 2002 EX-L has now become totally impractical in my 2021 EX-L. I wonder why Honda doesn't think this is important any longer? They could have designed this to work a different way, if they wanted to.

Your right it is ridiculous, I believe you can reach and feel the control shaft without all of the removal of everything he listed except the air intake duct, it only has 2 plastic clips to remove and slide off the air box chamber...

I know I could reach it but I have long arms. Using a crescent wrench (either American or Metric tool) should work, as there is no special tool for this. Unless you a metal millwright and can design and build a special socket and sell it to people that have this 10 speed transmission. I would be the first on in line. Here's a slight better picture of the neutral control shaft.

 

[smufguy]

I know I could reach it but I have long arms. Using a crescent wrench (either American or Metric tool) should work, as there is no special tool for this. Unless you a metal millwright and can design and build a special socket and sell it to people that have this 10 speed transmission. I would be the first on in line. Here's a slight better picture of the neutral control shaft.

Using that concept of a socket at the end of a flexible rod, similar to those flex rods used on electrical drill for hard to reach areas, and the other end to a knob would help folks who find themselves in this situation. However, a portable jump box is the easiest solution to a vehicle with a dead battery.

@hokie21 , what was the reason your van failed to start?

 

[DJVAN]

Using that concept of a socket at the end of a flexible rod, similar to those flex rods used on electrical drill for hard to reach areas, and the other end to a knob would help folks who find themselves in this situation. However, a portable jump box is the easiest solution to a vehicle with a dead battery.

@hokie21 , what was the reason your van failed to start?

Next Spring I will try and buy some solid plastic rod and cut it to length and drill out the center of the plastic rod to the outside diameter of the Neutral shaft and use a Dremel on opposite end to carve out the plastic rod to have the flat spot to fit . Last drill the opposite end with a square opening to make it work for a 3/8" extension or ratchet. I will post it on this forum and try to give all the measurements for everyone to make if they want to.

 

[Stan-qaz]

I've seen folks make a tool for similar situations with 1/4 inch socket wrench extensions, U-joints and a flexible rubber hose to keep them pointed in the right direction.

 

[DJVAN]

I've seen folks make a tool for similar situations with 1/4 inch socket wrench extensions, U-joints and a flexible rubber hose to keep them pointed in the right direction.

Necessity is the tool of invention. Long live the necessity for creation!

 

[Bproksch]

So same problem and follow up question: when I turn it into neutral with the wrench unless I hold it turned it just clicks right back to park. Is there a way to keep it in neutral without holding it (hard to get it towed when I’m under the hood with a wrench!!!).

 

[hokie21]

I've opened a case with Honda asking for the procedure for a no-power flatbed tow. I'll report back what they tell me. I'm not expecting much. I'll mention this to them about it not staying in neutral after the wrench has been turned.

 

[TBISU]

I'm incredulous reading these posts. In 2020 it sounds like Honda has taken a major step backwards in convenience. I was skeptical about the electric shifter, but this is ridiculous!

 

[smufguy]

I'm incredulous reading these posts. In 2020 it sounds like Honda has taken a major step backwards in convenience. I was skeptical about the electric shifter, but this is ridiculous!

The 10spd came out in the Odyssey couple of years ago, then it went into the RDX. Not many have issues with a 10spd and a dead battery when properly maintained. Given the packaging constraints, not everything can be accomplished and the 9spd is a ZF derived and the 10spd is in-house. Besides, making things accessible to customers is not always the best either.

 

[hokie21]

I think that batteries can fail even when properly maintained. In my case, the battery was fine. Honda just neglected to make a secure battery cable connection at the factory. This resulted in my car being dragged onto the flatbed in "park" because Hondlink towing could figure out no other way to load the car.

I think that saying "not everything can be accomplished" is what I am expecting the Honda folks to say. I'm a product design engineer. When we develop products have use cases that MUST be accommodated in our product designs. Being able to flatbed tow a car that has no power without damaging the car seems to me to be one of those basic "minimum viable product" use cases that Honda SHOULD have designed for. My 1999 CRV and 2002 Odyssey easily accommodated this use case.

 

[Bproksch]

Fun little tidbit: it popped a transmission warning once we got it jumped. Then I had to explain to the Honda dealer service guy how you get that dumb thing in neutral with a dead battery... while it is in there on this electrical issue, there is a mirror problem (won’t go back to regular after put in reverse) and 4 (FOUR!!!!) recall notices. What a great car. It’s 2.5 years old, 34,000 miles and it had already been in for more service than the 14-year old Hyundai Elantra with 160k miles we bought it to replace.

 

[smufguy]

Batteries can surely fail regardless of how well maintained they were; I had a game of tag with another member on this forum just about the battery operating life. HMA (Honda Manufacturing of Alabama) is not known, currently, for its stellar workmanship; Honda (not too long ago) admitted that and promised to work towards getting that fixed. It was a slow decline, and thus it will be a slow progress. Fit and finish and torqueing of bolts, nuts screws, etc is basic and we all miss that about Honda where we were excited when we saw the JHM on our VIN plates.

As a product design engineer, I hope you can understand that people dont behave similar to designed or programmed systems. When people get involved, things start to go haywire; same institution, multiple representatives could provide you with multiple responses. In this case, the tow operator either forgot, was lazy, or was never aware of the procedure. There are certain documented procedures that are made available to the dealership and come with an advisory that it cannot be shared with a customer. Maybe it is one of those, who knows. Hopefully the open ticket with support about this could yield something. Also, ethics and philosophies that govern your institution or department, may not be similar or viable to another.

Yes, given a price point, vehicle intent, target market, etc not everything can be accomplished. Packaging constrains could yield a more complex system and its servicing may not be viable or attainable for all consumers. With the vehicles complexity compounding as the days go by and the number of systems that depend on each other just to get the vehicle started, it is very involving and taxing to just troubleshoot and a misstep can cause huge loss.

To sum it up, I hear you. I can understand your frustration. There is a reason why I am here trying to understand all the issues others face (though I have not faced them) so I may learn and prevent being a subject of those scenarios and blowing my lid. I have a lot of interest in learning, but I have very little patience.

 

[DJVAN]

I think that batteries can fail even when properly maintained. In my case, the battery was fine. Honda just neglected to make a secure battery cable connection at the factory. This resulted in my car being dragged onto the flatbed in "park" because Hondlink towing could figure out no other way to load the car.

I think that saying "not everything can be accomplished" is what I am expecting the Honda folks to say. I'm a product design engineer. When we develop products have use cases that MUST be accommodated in our product designs. Being able to flatbed tow a car that has no power without damaging the car seems to me to be one of those basic "minimum viable product" use cases that Honda SHOULD have designed for. My 1999 CRV and 2002 Odyssey easily accommodated this use case.

To be honest I would never allow a tow truck driver drag any car to get it onto a flat bed. That is a cheap operation of the tow truck company not having a pair of wheel dollies to put under the front tires and lift off the ground to pull up on a flat bed. You have to ask for them while calling for a tow unless you are just using a standard tow truck.

 

[fuego]

Considering all things the lock on the ZF 9HP is quite accessible. Without removing anything. The tool however I can not justify the $200. “German Engineering”

On the Honda 10AT feels like a bit more involved process. I could be wrong. I don’t have a 10 speed to refer to.

 

[seanpw]

I've seen folks make a tool for similar situations with 1/4 inch socket wrench extensions, U-joints and a flexible rubber hose to keep them pointed in the right direction.

I'm interested if anyone has a 9-spd tool diagram to make one.

What's inside this black

box? Is there a button to push or turn? Is the ring to keep it on my keychain?

 

[Dmako]

I have one got off eBay for like $20. It just turns the strut on top of transmission and holds it in that position.

Wow! They want $149 for it now

 

[seanpw]

Yeah, thats why I'd like to make one, but not sure where to start.
Seems like for $20 in parts and old tools, it should be possible. I wouldn't need that fancy black box.😜

 

[fuego]

Lock Release 07AAA-TZ3A100 | College Hills Honda Parts

07AAA-TZ3A100 - Lock Release

www.collegehillshondaparts.com

$230