Looking at buying 2012 Odyssey

I recently bought a 2011 with 201k miles. I might be a little crazy! I've already put over 3k miles on it. I may be a damn fool, but I'm sure enjoying it, using it as a work vehicle.

It was a private sale and I did my own inspection. I was more than a little naive, but if I saw this vehicle today, I'd still buy it. I would just negotiate off another $500.

A few things I wish I looked at closer:

• Look carefully at the spare tire well. Although my car is not a flood car, it clearly had a "moonroof deluge" that had water ending up in the wheel well.
• Get an OBD II reader, something like a Veepeak, for less than $35 and learn how to use it. I use the free "Carscanner" app and it works good enough. Read the DTC codes and see if any are pending. See if emissions are ready. See how many warm ups since last DTC clearing. I did not do enough in this area and discovered they were hiding a P0420. Any pending DTCs may not light the "check engine," but are a sign of future issues.
• Pay attention to the shifts on the test drive
• Check the color of the ATF fluid
• Check the operation of the doors in 3 ways: remote control, buttons, and just yanking the door handle.
• Check the spool valve area and look for leaks. I actually got lucky here, mine is clean. There's good info here, read up on it and look very carefully.

Dumb stuff I had to do because of my inattention:
1) Clean the spare well, mold remediate it, and paint the cover
2) Install some spark plug non-foulers on the oxygen sensor to get rid of the P0420. I can't afford a new catalyst until next year, which I'll have to get before the smog check
3) Triple change the ATF. Carfax said it was changed right before I bought it. I think the service company screwed the previous owners and skipped it because they knew the car was going for sale.

Good stuff I learned here:
1) What a P0420 is. What the non-fouler trick does, and doesn't do. Just how likely the VCM fouled the catalyst. Hope and prayer that "Cataclean" will fix it is just that. Hope. It is likely a bad cat due to VCM.
2) What the benefit of a VCM disabler is. My story: when ECO comes on while on the freeway, then I hit the gas, I see blue smoke. Burning off the oil - which fouled the cats over time since the previous owners didn't disable VCM. Now that I have ECO disabled, no blue smoke, no oil consumption, and I pray no misfires in the near future.

BTW: agree about the brakes and rotors, but I'm just living with it. I had GM cars in the 80s and they pulsed the daylights out of my foot. I guess that is something else to realize: you are buying an older car with some miles, you may choose to live with some things. This is not a new car.

Just got a 2012 EX-L, roughly the same mileage as the ones you're looking at.

Check the suspension - if you notice a lot of noise and bumping while driving, it likely needs struts/shocks. My front ones were worn mostly out at 125k miles, some folks say they last to 150k but I guess I didn't get lucky. Rear shocks tend to fail around 80k, mine are definitely bad (you can check by kneeling on the rear bumper and watching if the rear end bounces after you let your knee off, it shouldn't bounce at all).

CV axles - tend to fail around 130k. Mine were both going bad (FL was straight up clicking when turning, FR made a vibration due to the intermediate shaft bearing going out, felt similar to a bad wheel bearing).

ATF - if it's brown, it's likely not been changed for a bit.

Power steering pump - if it's making a sound like a bad bearing (whining while operating), know that there's a chance it's not a bad bearing but rather the inlet o-ring has shrunken over time and is letting air into the fluid stream (thus cavitating the pump and making noise; it's not great for the pump, but it's also not the end of the world). If it is making noise, definitely argue the price down as though it were a bad pump just in case it truly is a bad pump, but don't let it be a complete deal breaker for the van. It could only take $5 worth of o-rings to get rid of the noise.

VCM Disabler - look to see if one is already installed (plugs into Coolant Temp Sensor 1 port on driver's side of engine; if it's a smart controller, you can often see the small gauge power wire coming directly off the battery). If so, that's an indication the previous owner knew what they were doing and gave more than a single dang about their vehicle's wellbeing.

I'll let you know if I think of anything else.

Ha, maybe the anecdotal evidence I used while searching for my own Odyssey was incorrect. I turned down a number of decent vans with the 6-speed specifically because I wanted better reliability, whoops. That being said, if that's the worst way I've been bit during this used van search, that's still not doing terribly.

(Regarding what you said about Honda only keeping the 5-speed until they felt comfortable with the 6-speed: they also kept non-VCM engines in the lower trim 2005-2010 vans because they weren't as comfortable with rolling VCM out to everyone, but the host of issues we've all seen with VCM didn't keep them from rolling it out across the board anyway for their benefit. I can't help but wonder if they did something similar when rolling out the 6-speed, although I still have no hard evidence indicating such.)

kayjay, please do update us if you decide to get one.

JwrKy said:

Ha, maybe the anecdotal evidence I used while searching for my own Odyssey was incorrect. I turned down a number of decent vans with the 6-speed specifically because I wanted better reliability, whoops. That being said, if that's the worst way I've been bit during this used van search, that's still not doing terribly.

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I agree with you - I'm confident your van is going to serve you really well. You just restricted yourself more than necessary during your shopping process. You likely still made a great choice.

JwrKy said:

(Regarding what you said about Honda only keeping the 5-speed until they felt comfortable with the 6-speed: they also kept non-VCM engines in the lower trim 2005-2010 vans because they weren't as comfortable with rolling VCM out to everyone, but the host of issues we've all seen with VCM didn't keep them from rolling it out across the board anyway for their benefit. I can't help but wonder if they did something similar when rolling out the 6-speed, although I still have no hard evidence indicating such.)

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I think the reasons behind keeping VCM were a lot different. Honda kept VCM even after it proved troublesome because they didn't have a good alternative anywhere in their product pipeline. Whatever they paid in warranty repairs over the years is probably still less than the EPA penalties they would have incurred over the same time period, so it was simply taken in as another cost of doing business. The Honda and Acura models featuring VCM-enabled V6 engines were still profitable, just a little bit less profitable than originally planned. If there was a viable replacement (eg. diesel, turbo 4, hybrid) anywhere near ready, I doubt VCM would have survived those first few years. And look at the situation now - VCM-enabled V6s have been available from Honda for nearly 20 years and there's still uncertainty about when a hybrid drivetrain might show up in the Odyssey to bump out the V6. Honda's not moving quickly on this stuff at all.

In contrast, it was probably a pretty easy decision to drop a very good older transmission in favour of an also very good newer transmission - there was no downside to making that move. The extra gear probably helped a bit with fuel economy (which is usually the point of increasing the number of gears in vehicles like this) and reliability didn't take a hit, so that's a win-win for everyone.

The EPA and CAFE standards are very important for the corporate numbers. They will prioritize this. Problems with rings and catalytic converters (that's me) after 150k miles are of lessor concern. I'm not going to say they are of no concern, just lessor concern.

My 2011 Ody I bought at 201k miles (now 204k) has a blown catalytic converter because of VCM. I was a GM, then Toyota, then Subaru guy. I always heard legendary stories about Honda. Now that I own one, the stories are not so legendary.

Not saying I'd put Honda on my sh.. list, but they are not Saints. I'd consider Honda, but Toyota is still #1 in my mind, and the nonsense I'm dealing with on my 2011 Ody has me pumping the brakes on any future Honda purchase. They should know this. For the record, my VCM induced issues are: non-fouler extensions on the O2 sensor, then likely a cat converter replacement next year before smog check.

kayjay said:

Hi all - first of all, thanks for being here and providing such excellent Honda Odyssey info in one place!

I am a newbie here and to Honda Odysseys in general trying to educate myself on Odyssey maintenance and ownership. I am going to look/test drive two different 2012 Honda Odysseys tomorrow, they are single owner vehicles in the 98k - 130k mile range that appear to be in really nice shape, from photos, and at least one of them looks to have had impeccable service records from the carfax. Both have had the timing belt/water pump service. They are in the $13,500 - $14, 000 range (ugh, this used car market right now is terrible!!)

I was wondering if ya'll had anything to share about particular items or apsects unique to Odyssey of this generation I should be paying attention during my test drive and vehicle inspection, aside from the usual things one might look at on a used car(eg, noises & vibrations, fluds assessment, rust/leaks, etc). Unfortunately I might not be able to arrange for a proper mechanic assesment (no fault of seller)- so hopingto glean what I can ahead of time.

In the meantime I will be trying to read up and understand this VCM issue which sounds like comes with this generation...are there some tip offs to watch out for that this particular vehicle might be suffering?

Thanks!

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My '12 EX-L was just totaled by a careless driver, so I am also trying to find a similar vehicle. Most of the similar cars I have seen have not had the TB service done, but I needed to ask the dealer multiple times to get that answer. Many cars of this age and mileage, 10 years and about 120k miles, were traded in because the owner didn't want to spend $2k getting needed services done. At that mileage the spark plugs should have also been done. If you do it yourself, it is under $100. A dealer will charge about $350. If you do it yourself, get the proper NGK iridium plugs, they are expensive buy well worth it. The coolant should have also been replaced at the time of the TB service, if it wasn't figure on about $200 to have the dealer do it. Check the front door arm rests, they rip at this age. They start by wrinkling first then they bubble up then they tear. You can get just the vinyl covers, both sides, for about $30 on ebay. The replacements from Honda are $156 each. At discount figure on $120 each. I did the cheap covers on ebay. If doing it again, I would pay $120 to get them from the dealer. The DIY cover replacement is time consuming and if you are not experienced, it is difficult to not get wrinkles. It also takes about 2 hours per side when you factor in drying time for the contact cement and removing and installing the cover. I would do a test drive and do some hard braking to check for the common warped front rotors. The transmission fluid should have had a drain and refill about every 30k miles. If it wasn't done, you want to do a drain and fill process 3 times to get fresh fluid throughout. I would check the cabin air filters, these are often ignored by many owners. You should change them about every 20k miles. You will be surprised at how dirty they can get. Keys are expensive, the car should come with three keys. Two with built in remotes and a third valet key. At this age the car is probably on it's second battery and this battery is probably close to end of life. I would check the battery date and if 5 years old, or older, plan on replacing it. Carefully check the tires. You want matching tires with even wear. Again, at this mileage it should be on it's second set and probably in need of replacement. If the tires are new and not a reputable brand, I would replace them. Any tires made in China are garbage I should be tossed right away. Check the rubber snorkel that goes from the air box to the throttle body, they tend to crack and leak air at this age. That will cause drivability issues. Check the spool valve for leaks. If it is leaking, factor in the cost of a rebuilt alternator. Only get a Denso and figure on $350 for just the alternator. The active engine mounts are also something else to check. They can go bad due to the VCM issues and they are both expensive and difficult to swap. If you don't ready have one, you should get a cheap OBD code reader and check to see if there are any codes stored that might need attention.

Ideally you would want to buy from a private party that has taken care of the car themselves or had a trusted mechanic do it for them. One owner is ideal. I would do that, but I really need to replace my Odyssey soon and I am only seeing dealer cars that seem to be ok. I have seen a lot of car flipper specials and other sketchy dealer cars that I am keeping away from. If you have the time and patience, wait for the right car to come along. It should cost closer to $10k than to $14k.