[Mommyvan]

Hello all! My husband tried to install an Evenflo Titan V convertible seat rear-facing into the Ody and couldn't get it stable enough. (He was up to about 6" of towel under the front of the child seat when we gave up. Even with me sitting in the seat, he couldn't pull the LATCH buckle tight enough to make it solid.) He thinks that the base of the child seat isn't big enough for that soft seat cushion (2nd row captains chair). Can anyone tell me if they've had a similar problem or if we can fit something safely and legally under the child seat to make it fit? (My husband wondered if he could build a wooden ramp nearly the width of the car seat for under the child seat....) Any suggestions for a different convertible seat for a large baby? (She is 19 lbs and about 28" at 8 months...) I'd rather not pay the money for a Britax unless it's necessary.

Thanks in advance for all of your suggestions/help. Have a safe and happy new year!!!

 

[Ody-sama]

Happy New Year!

Our daughter (now three) uses the Evenflo Triump 5 with similar base, installed front facing in the 2nd row captain's chair. She had earlier used it rear facing for an year.

We've never been able to perfectly install our car seats irrespective of the brand or the vehicle. You would notice there is not much difference in the ease of installation amongst the name brands -

http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/CPS/CSSRating/Index.cfm

Some Evenflos and Britaxes are 'B' rated.

One of our neighbors is a state trooper and a certified car seat technician. He is always happy to oblige the parents with the installation and we are ever so grateful. He advises against using any improvised accessories (such as a wooden ramp). See if you can get a local inspection station install the seat for you -

http://www.seatcheck.org/index.html

Otherwise you can replace it with another convertible that you can install tightly by yourselves.

 

[blue2pink0]

I have 2 Britaxs (both Marathon and FF)and love them b/c of the tether straps for this very reason. In the past when I had Roundabouts that were Rear Facing, I had to use noodles from the firestation to get a good fit (in my Passat and Dodge Grand Caravan).

I would definately advise you to get a certified car seat installer to check it out for you. It's free and if they can't get a good fit, then perhaps you might think about a new carseat.

I like this website b/c you can search for your type of vehicle and carseat and see if others are having difficulty getting them to fit or not.

www.carseatdata.org

There are a couple techs who post here, so I'm sure they can/will give you good advice!

 

[toront06ody]

You'll find that problem with most brands when rear-facing. You won't necessarily get it to have less than 1" play because you don't have a rear strap to secure it to a tether.

You'll have to put your knee into it and yank as hard as you can to get it snug. Even so, there may be a bit of side-to-side play (not more than 2-3"). It is a much easier (and mentally reassuring) install when it is forward facing and you can connect the rear tether strap.

 

[shellebelle]

Hmmm...I haven't heard many complaints about installing the Titan. I can only recall installing it in a Kia with a lap-only belt, so that isn't much help.

I'm curious what the trouble is. Is it just too hard to pull the adjusting tail on the LATCH strap? Or, no matter how much you tighten it it the car seat just won't tighten well? Also, take note of where the the LATCH anchors are in respect to the width of the car seat. If they're "hidden" by the width of the car seat, then that is often the problem. LATCH seems to work best when the car seat or car seat base nestles neatly in between the anchors.

One last thing to try is to have either you or your husband get behind the car seat after you've hooked up the LATCH, and kind of lean over it so you get your hips or belly in contact with the very top of the car seat. Then, grasp the strap you pull to tighten the LATCH and pull. This will pull your hips into the seat, which will compress the seat cushion, and this will create slack that you can pull out.

If that doesn't work, I think you best bet is to visit a technician like others have mentioned (it's free, and only takes about an hour of your time), or switch to installing with the seat belt.

Let us know if that does the trick, or if you have any other questions.

Oh, and the wooden ramp really isn't the best idea. The fact that it's hard makes it impossible to properly tighten the car seat to the vehicle, and if for some reason it came loose in a crash it has a good chance of killing someone. With respect to loose items in the car, I tell parents to only leave things out that they'd be willing to throw at their child's head (and then most of them gather up everything--even the ok items--and put them in the trunk )

 

[Mommyvan]

Hi All,

Thanks for the replies. This is "the husband" ...

I have no problem tightening the strap. My wife was in there leaning on it, and I tightened it as much as it could go. The problem is that the 2nd row captains chairs slope down so much that it takes about 6 inches of filler to get the carseat back at a 45 degree angle. I was using towels for filler, and that made it so I could not get the recommended 1 inch of play in the seat. It seems there is just too much (not very solid) filler. It probably only had 3 inches of play, but I am not convinced that it will remain stable over the next 4 months or so.

We are currently using an infant seat (which our daughter has almost grown out of). That seat works well, because it has an adjustable base. I have that base fully extended, and it just barely meets the 45 degree angle requirement. Obviously, the Titan V does not have an adjustable base.

We went and looked at some other car seats and were not convinced that any of them would fit any better. It still seems like we would need about 6 inches of fill to get the 45 degree angle with any of the other rear facing carseats as well. (I was quite annoyed with our local Toys-R-Us because they would not let me just leave a driver's license and/or credit card and take the carseat to try in the van).

Do you think I can build up 6 inches of pool noodles to get a good fit?

Maybe I am missing something obvious here, but I cannot believe nobody else has had this problem. Unless they are not so ... let's say "picky" ... about how the carseat installation meets the recommendations.

PS: I am gathering a set of objects to throw at my daughter's head to see if I want them installed in the van. I am going to try them out on our older daugter first before moving ont o the youngest

 

[egads]

When I put my grandson's rear facing seat in I reclined the back of the seat and tightened the straps that hook onto the Latch rings. When I put the seatback upright again everything was tight. I don't know exactly which model it was, but it has a base that mounts into the car and then the seat itself locks into that. It also locks into a matching stroller. Eddie Bauer?

 

[shellebelle]

Hi All,

Thanks for the replies. This is "the husband" ...

Daddyvan, there's some solutions for you.

1) an older infant can be plenty happy riding at a 30* angle, which should be pretty easy to get. The 45* for rear facing is strict for newborns because they need to to keep their head from falling forward and cutting off their airway. Once the child has head control and is in a convertible seat such as yours, 30-45 degrees is fine. Go with what you can get the seat installed with and what your child is happy with.

2) the 6" or so of towels is probably too squishy for you to get a 45* angle with AND get the seat tight. As I mentioned in #1, try installing the seat more upright, and try to use as few towels as possible. Better yet, visit a Toys R Us or Babies R Us and get a "car seat leveler"--it's basically a triangle of foam that you set in the buttcrack of the vehicle seat and it makes for a flatter surface. They work very well. The thick pool noodles also work great--at work we have the 6" variety. At this time of year you'd probably have to visit a pool supply store to get them. I had quite a bit of difficulty getting the one I have, and that was in October of '03. If you have to resort to the regular variety, cut off three 9" sections or so and tape them into a pyramid and use that. The noodles help with the recline more than the leveler does.

egad's trick of reclining the vehicle seat back and then uprighting it works very well too.

I'm surprised Toys R Us didn't let you take the seat out. They're supposed to. Babies R Us doesn't give you any hassle (usually). I had to try two seats in my car and they were plenty happy to haul both out in the pouring rain.

Let us know if these suggestions get you where you need to be.

 

[Mommyvan]

Well, we found a pool supply place that had a few pool noodles. (You can tell it's Minnesota...both places in town each had 3-4 noodles in stock--that's it.) The pool noodle worked well for anchoring the seat....we used four 9" noodles. Three in the shape of a triangle and one extra attached to the triangle base tucked into the back of the Ody's seat (all bound together, of course). We also used egads tip of reclining the vehicle's seat back, which helped with the lever that lets us adjust the child seat's straps. It seems that the problem we were having had to do with the lever that lets the seat adjust from rear-facing to front-facing....The seat is more than 9" across at that point and the LATCH straps were getting stuck on it. (My husband didn't realize it at first....) Now we have a very tight fit for the child seat. Again, thank you all for your help.

Shellebelle, we didn't realize that child seats could be anywhere from 30-45 degrees in the rear facing position for an older child. Everything we've always been told/read said that it must be 45 degrees in rear-facing mode.

I love Babies R Us for their car seat availability and ease of trying them in your vehicle, but the nearest one is about 1-1/2 hours from our house. The Toys R Us in town was busy when my husband asked to take a seat out to try it and they required that someone accompany the car seat at all times, but didn't have enough personnel to do that. They also didn't have the car seat leveler that you had mentioned. They are really good about some things at this Toys R Us...not so good with others. Small towns....

 

[shellebelle]

Yeah, it's that case around here too. I'm smack dab in the middle of Suburbia so we've got everything around. When I've done seminars at Babies R Us they've actually sent me out with parents in a pinch. I actually like doing these seminars quite a bit, all the BRU employees disappear from the car seat aisle and I run the show

I'm glad you were able to get the seat in.

Now, on a totally unrelated note, I have a friend who my be moving to Minnesota. I don't know whereabouts, but is she going to shrivel up and die in the cold? She grew up here in coastal CA but has been in UT for the past few years attending school. I'm just worried that it'll be a big shock for her (she'll have a little one when she moves, too).

 

[CPSDarren]

Well, we found a pool supply place that had a few pool noodles. (You can tell it's Minnesota...both places in town each had 3-4 noodles in stock--that's it.) The pool noodle worked well for anchoring the seat....we used four 9" noodles. Three in the shape of a triangle and one extra attached to the triangle base tucked into the back of the Ody's seat (all bound together, of course). We also used egads tip of reclining the vehicle's seat back, which helped with the lever that lets us adjust the child seat's straps. It seems that the problem we were having had to do with the lever that lets the seat adjust from rear-facing to front-facing....The seat is more than 9" across at that point and the LATCH straps were getting stuck on it. (My husband didn't realize it at first....) Now we have a very tight fit for the child seat. Again, thank you all for your help.

Shellebelle, we didn't realize that child seats could be anywhere from 30-45 degrees in the rear facing position for an older child. Everything we've always been told/read said that it must be 45 degrees in rear-facing mode.

I love Babies R Us for their car seat availability and ease of trying them in your vehicle, but the nearest one is about 1-1/2 hours from our house. The Toys R Us in town was busy when my husband asked to take a seat out to try it and they required that someone accompany the car seat at all times, but didn't have enough personnel to do that. They also didn't have the car seat leveler that you had mentioned. They are really good about some things at this Toys R Us...not so good with others. Small towns....

The 45 degree angle is a maximum limit recommended for newborns and young infants. Being upright is actually safer from a crash perspective. Small babies have the added risk of a possible airway obstruction if they are too upright and their heads flop forward. Once they are 6 months or so and have good neck strength to support their heads well, then it is perfectly fine and even a bit safer to be more upright.

Using noodles to increase the recline is generally OK if you don't exceed the 45 degree maximum. As you have found, they sometimes have the added advantage of giving you just enough extra length to be able to tighten a LATCH attachment or seatbelt just enough to make it snug.

Keep in mind that 1" of play is a reasonable installation. It doesn't have to be rock solid. Also, that 1" of movement is to be taken at the base of the seat where the seatbelt or LATCH straps are located. When you grab it there, it should not move much over an inch side-to-side or back-to-front. Twisting motions and movement farther up or back on the carseat will be greater and that is usually OK.

Definitely make an appointment with a certified technician before doing anything unusual, like making a wooden ramp;-) They might be able to get it in tight enough for you. If that failed, a different seat would be the next option. I think we have some Titans in our storage area. If you continue to have difficulties, I could make a trip there to try one in my Odyssey. Just let me know.

Also, plenty of other general tips can be found here:

http://www.car-safety.org/odyssey.html

 

[Mommyvan]

Now, on a totally unrelated note, I have a friend who my be moving to Minnesota. I don't know whereabouts, but is she going to shrivel up and die in the cold? She grew up here in coastal CA but has been in UT for the past few years attending school. I'm just worried that it'll be a big shock for her (she'll have a little one when she moves, too).

Shellebelle, I went to weather.com and checked out the averages for Salt Lake City and Minneapolis. In December, January and February, Minneapolis averages about 15 degrees colder per month. (Rochester is about the same temperature as Minneapolis, but we get much less precipitation, especially ice.) The rest of the year will be much closer in temperature for your friend. I think the real shock will be the wind. It's very windy here, which sometimes makes it feel much colder than it really is. My advice is to get as large a house/apartment as she can comfortably afford so that there is more room to move around in during the really cold months. Many towns in Minnesota have really good indoor play areas, Early Childhood Family Ed classes, etc... for kids. I really like Minnesota and my three-year-old loves going outside in the snow. (Although sometimes she gets really bummed because it looks great outside, but it's actually 0 degrees or so and I won't let her go out. Anything over 15 degrees is fine for 20 minutes or so and really improves her mood.)

We thought that the car seat couldn't have more than an inch of play at the area where it was not attached to the vehicle's seat. Our car seats don't move at all once we get them installed.

 

[shellebelle]

We thought that the car seat couldn't have more than an inch of play at the area where it was not attached to the vehicle's seat. Our car seats don't move at all once we get them installed.

*psst...I don't like my seats to move at all either

Thanks for the advice regarding Minnesota, I'll pass that along the next time I talk to my friend.

 

[CPSDarren]

We thought that the car seat couldn't have more than an inch of play at the area where it was not attached to the vehicle's seat. Our car seats don't move at all once we get them installed.

With the possible exception of some models that allow a tether to be used rear-facing, it's very difficult to install a rear-facing seat with no play at the back or top of the seat. It's pretty much a given that you will be able to twist and rotate the seat there, even on a good installation.

 

[Mommyvan]

Darren,

You are (of course) right. I can make the top of the car seat move slightly when I pull on it, but the base underneath of it literally does not move. (We are pain-in-the-butt perfectionists.)

 

[CPSDarren]

Sounds like you are good to go

 

[Rusty]

Question about the Britax Roundabout....

Is it okay to have this car seat RECLINED while installed forward facing? We have two, one in each vehicle, and they are both fully reclined forward facing so my daughter's head does not flop if she falls asleep. Thanks for your advice.

 

[CPSDarren]

Question about the Britax Roundabout....

Is it okay to have this car seat RECLINED while installed forward facing? We have two, one in each vehicle, and they are both fully reclined forward facing so my daughter's head does not flop if she falls asleep. Thanks for your advice.

It is OK to use the recline while forward facing, but it is usually safer to be in the upright position. Britax changes their manuals and recommendations periodically, so you should verify this for yourself by calling Britax customer service, if possible.