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I had about 70k miles between my spark plug change, and they don't look too bad. I had the EGR port cleanout earlier this year, I had to use brushes, wire, drill bit, vacuum and compress air to clean the entire intake manifold, it was so dirty that the EGR port at the intake manifold was plugged completely by the mud-like stuff, I think that was the poor design by Honda on this port too...
 

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Original plugs changed at 127K miles / 212K Km

Hello All, just wanted to show what my original spark plugs looked like after 12 years and one month in my 2003 EX-L. We don't put a lot of miles/clicks on it however after reading the posts in this thread I decided I had better change the plugs. Since they had been in there so long and its too cold to do it myself here I took it to my regular Honda Dealer for them to be changed. They did say they should have changed them when the TB and WP was done at 110K Miles/184K Km's, for whatever reason it was not done (probably me not wanting to spend the extra $$ and thinking I would do it myself.

The mechanic said the plugs looked good and to keep on doing whatever it was I was doing.....

Here are the pictures 2015-01-29 16.05.41.jpg 2015-01-29 16.04.53.jpg 2015-01-29 16.04.12.jpg 2015-01-29 16.03.02.jpg 2015-01-29 16.02.06.jpg 2015-01-29 16.00.59.jpg 2015-01-29 16.00.31.jpg

I checked the gap (it took me a while to find my gapping tool which I haven't used in a long long time) and they were all 0.042 except for #1 which was a little less ~ 0.040".

Anyone know what he gap should be?

I have only driven it for a few short trips, it seems to start smoother and have more power at low rpms if that makes any sense. The real test will be fuel consumption which I will report back on as soon as I have some mileage accumulated.

Hope the pictures work this is the first time I try this....
 

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They look very good overall, including the slight discoloration on the insulators. My brother changed his plugs at 170k miles and they also looked good. He, however, noticed no difference in mpg,idle or power. His miles were mainly freeway and very little city mileage.
http://www.odyclub.com/forums/24-1999-2004-odyssey/154612-spark-plug-gap-clarified-ngk.html
Google is your info center.
Hopefully you will get a lot more trouble free miles out of your Ody. Don't forget to browse on atf fluids and changes and the cabin air filter. :ahh:
Buffalo4
 

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Hi all.

I'm getting great info from this forum, and just used it to change my plugs at 115K. All went smoothly.

Anti seized all the plugs, and left the gap from factory.

I'll see how she does in the next few months.

Thanks!
 

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Car was running fine but I could not remember the last time the plugs were changed. I'm guessing at least 100K miles. This is what they looked like when I took them out. Glad I did. they were getting rusty and I could tell they were on their way to getting seized. I replaced them with NGK PZFR5F-11 4363. have not noticed any significant difference, seems to idle a little smoother (could be in my head).

Do you guys see any signs of other issues from the wear (unfortunately I didnt keep track of which cylinder each came from) :
 

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Those plugs look great...aside from the rust that was starting to form on the threads (yes, seizing on the way).

OF
 

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I'd like some advise on attempting to replace spark plugs. My '01 Ody has 160,000 miles and the spark pugs are original. Some have said the original plugs were installed without antisieze. If that is the case, the plugs are probably not coming out. Also, differing views on whether to remove plugs with engine cold vs. warm. The van runs fine. Any suggestions are appreciated. Thanks
 

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From the Pep Boys' web site:

The Tougher Job: Plug Removal

It’s not unusual to have difficulty removing a used spark plug. Be sure to allow the engine to cool before attempting the job, and always be sure to clean away all debris around the plug prior to removal or use compressed air to prevent entry into the engine. If the plug appears to be overly tight and/or there is corrosion surrounding its base, it is acceptable to apply a quantity of penetrating oil (rust breaker). After allowing the penetrant to do its job (most require at least 5 minutes), apply steady pressure with a spark plug wrench until the spark plug loosens. Do not yank on the wrench, as this could cause breakage.

For especially difficult to remove plugs, try loosening ¼ turn, then retightening. Repeat this process while reapplying penetrating oil until the plug is removed.

It’s always a good idea to use a thread chaser tool to remove carbon and other contaminants from the threads in the head before installing a new spark plug.


What they have to say about hot versus cold:

Allow the engine to cool down to a room/shop temperature. (most applications). Attempting to remove the spark plugs from a HOT engine may cause the spark plug threads to seize, causing damage to the cylinder head threads.

Again, if the plugs are proving difficult to remove:

If the spark plug is difficult to unthread, STOP, and use penetrating lubricant and allow it to soak for at least 5 minutes. Then tighten the spark plug back up and try removing it again. It may be necessary to follow this procedure several times until the spark plug is removed.

Hope that helps.

OF
 

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The OE NGK plugs have an anti-seize coating from the factory. So anti-seize was not needed when the engine was assembled. (I assume this was the case when your 2001 was built.)

However, 160K miles is a long run. Kudos to you for anticipating a difficult removal. Wrongly removing a stiff plug can easily damage the threads in the head.

Also, running a spark plug long can weaken the coil pack due to the high resistance at the tip. Test each coil pack with a new spark plug. The spark should be blue, never yellow or orange.

Good luck!

Dave
 

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I'm set in my ways so will have to respectfully disagree with the link OF posted. I have always run the motor a bit to have "some heat" on the plug-head contact area. My reasoning is they are dissimilar metals and expand at different rates. I have a 3/8" breaker bar to crack them loose and ratchet after. I do use penetrating fluid if any tightness coming out.
Never had an issue on 100's of plugs.
 

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My advice, which is above also, is that once they are broken free and you start turning them out, if you run into any additional resistance, screw them back in a bit, then back out. Repeat as needed. When reinstalling be sure to properly torque them and double check them all. An improperly seated/torqued plug could be a major problem later on.
 

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mjody has it right, warm should be easier. The CTE of the steel plugs is 1/2 that of the aluminum head. Both are expanding on the diameter and since the head thread diameter is outside the plug thread diameter, the difference should be even greater. Once you have overcome the initial torque to break free, further resistance is due to carbon on the plug thread that was in the combustion chamber. Back and forth at this point may break off the carbon. It is doubtful penetrating oil will get down and soak the carbon unless you apply a lot of it and wait for it to soak down the clearances of the threads to the carbon.

Always install in a cold engine.

BTW, NGK recommends no anti-sieze as it changes the lubricity of the threads so that torquing to their specifications over-compresses the compressable washer. Their Tech Talk section warns of other over-torque caused failures. I've used anti-sieze and the finger-tight +1/2 turn for a very long time without problems.
 

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Most likely NGK specifies no anti-sieze be applied for legal reasons, not for what most of us do.
Yes, anti-sieze 'could' cause stripping the threads because of it's lube quality, esp when tightened with a torque wrench that is not accurate. :eek:
If you follow their 'manual' tightening recommendations, I don't see how it could ever cause a problem when you use anti-sieze.
Look up the torque tightening specs from NGK and compare them to Honda's. You may well be surprised!!
Me, I will always use anti-sieze. :ahh: :cheers:
Buffalo4
 

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I should have added my 2 cents to that cut-and-paste. Funny thing is, I've always told people that all aluminum alloys have a far different thermal expansion coefficient than steel alloys of any sort.

I've always removed plugs from a warm engine. Not a hot engine, but a warm engine. Goodness knows the hundreds and hundreds of times I've done a plug job, and warm was always easier.

Have used the penetrating oil bit, but nothing fancy. It works. When I decided to try 140,000 miles on a set of plugs in one of our 3 Odysseys, the back-and-forth trick with a shot of penetrating oil in between each attempt worked admirably well. The first one did not get penetrating oil, and it protested all the way to final removal. The other five came out much more easily.

Again, nothing cosmic...just Liquid Wrench, and I was amazed at how well the back-and-forth trick with a shot of penetrating oil worked on other aluminum head engines (mostly FIAT's and Alfa's and VW's and Porsche's), too, back in the day. This was also where the owner left the plugs in for far too long, and back when new spark plugs did not come with anything better than a black oxide treatment on the threads.

None of these had an excess of carbon past the first 360 degrees of spark plug threading. They almost always did have what looked like evidence of small amounts of galvanic corrosion almost all the way to the plug seat washer.

Next time I do a pull-and-reinstall at 50,000 miles of plug service, I'll dress the plug threads with a narrow & fine wire brush, clean them, anti-seize them, and re-install. Don't know why I didn't do the clean-up part like I used to do back when we frequently pulled and re-gapped plugs. Just forgot to do it.

dave is right. Check the coils. When I let them run for 140,000 miles, I ended up with 3 not-so-stellar coils, according to my plug tester. They started off bluish white hot, then the spark settled into a somewhat colder sickly orange, so they got replaced.

Anyways, for the OP, there are better choices than Liquid Wrench out there. PB blaster has been my generic favorite of late when working on anything from outboard engines to cars to boat trailers to power equipment.

OF
 

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CNN,
Did you ever post back with the results of your Bosch +4 plugs?
You said you were going to take pictures every 6k miles or so.
This is an exceptionally long thread and I went through most of it and I still might have missed it. :eek:
Thanks,
Buffalo4
PS: In my Honda Odyssey Shop Manual 99-04 on page 4-18 it states to put a small quantity of anti-sieze on the threads, screw them in hand tight and then torque them to "18 N·m(1.8 kgf·m, 13 lbf·f"
 

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One of the posts says to use a thread-chaser tool. Do you use the tool in the head (female threads), on the plug (male threads), or both? If you use the tool in the head, what happens to carbon that falls onto the piston? Is carbon falling onto the piston a problem? Please advise. Thanks.
 

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BTR, I've had carbon bits fall right into the cylinder during plug inspections and changes on every Honda we've owned, including the GCV160 on our lawn mower. No problem, those tiny bits will leave via the exhaust port(s). When they roll into the very hot catalytic converter, they will get combusted.

You try to have this not happen, but if it does, it is not a concern. It is only an icky combination of carbon and unburned oil.

I've known people to have carbon fiber reeds break and get sucked into a 2-stroke engine running at pretty good speed. That stuff got pulled into a 175hp Mercury V6. No damage, the now smashed bits got ejected out of the exhaust port.

The thread chaser is for the female threads, cylinder head. Use a wire brush to clean the threads on the plugs, if you so desire.

ody123 lifted this from his Honda service manual:

A. Use only the spark plugs listed below: NGK: PZFR5F-11 DENSO: PKJ16CR-L11

B. Apply a small quantity of anti-seize compound to the plug threads, and screw the plugs into the cylinder head finger-tight, then torque them to 1.8kg-m, 13 lb.ft.


13 ft.-lbs. is the same as 156 in.-lbs. for those with torque wrenches using those units. small quantity of anti-seize if re-installing plugs following an inspection. New NGK's have a plating on the threads that serves the dual purpose of lubricating the threads and anti-corrosion, no anti-seize required per the NGK site, but I still used a small quantity on my Odysseys, Accords, Civic and mower with no adverse effects.

Please use a quality torque wrench. Craftsman, S-K, ATD, Snap-On, Utica, Matco, MAC, and Proto all make good gear, but you pay for it. Always set clicker wrenches to zero before storing them. I do not trust the red Chinese import garbage from the local auto parts store. However, the ROC, Republic of China, A.K.A. Taiwan, is entirely trustworthy for high-precision manufacturing quality of accurate tools, but that is a whole 'nother topic for another thread.

OF
 

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BTR, I've had carbon bits fall right into the cylinder during plug inspections and changes on every Honda we've owned, including the GCV160 on our lawn mower. No problem, those tiny bits will leave via the exhaust port(s). When they roll into the very hot catalytic converter, they will get combusted.

You try to have this not happen, but if it does, it is not a concern. It is only an icky combination of carbon and unburned oil.

I've known people to have carbon fiber reeds break and get sucked into a 2-stroke engine running at pretty good speed. That stuff got pulled into a 175hp Mercury V6. No damage, the now smashed bits got ejected out of the exhaust port.

The thread chaser is for the female threads, cylinder head. Use a wire brush to clean the threads on the plugs, if you so desire.

ody123 lifted this from his Honda service manual:

A. Use only the spark plugs listed below: NGK: PZFR5F-11 DENSO: PKJ16CR-L11

B. Apply a small quantity of anti-seize compound to the plug threads, and screw the plugs into the cylinder head finger-tight, then torque them to 1.8kg-m, 13 lb.ft.


13 ft.-lbs. is the same as 156 in.-lbs. for those with torque wrenches using those units. small quantity of anti-seize if re-installing plugs following an inspection. New NGK's have a plating on the threads that serves the dual purpose of lubricating the threads and anti-corrosion, no anti-seize required per the NGK site, but I still used a small quantity on my Odysseys, Accords, Civic and mower with no adverse effects.

Please use a quality torque wrench. Craftsman, S-K, ATD, Snap-On, Utica, Matco, MAC, and Proto all make good gear, but you pay for it. Always set clicker wrenches to zero before storing them. I do not trust the red Chinese import garbage from the local auto parts store. However, the ROC, Republic of China, A.K.A. Taiwan, is entirely trustworthy for high-precision manufacturing quality of accurate tools, but that is a whole 'nother topic for another thread.

OF
Odyfamily, excellent advice! Thanks!
 

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Excellent torque wrench advice! I would add another step; check the sanity of the torque wrench before using it on the spark plug. You need to be in a position to realize that "hey, it should have clicked by this time" REGARDLESS how expensive torque wrench you are using.
Otherwise, hand tighten it using small ratchet instead.
 
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