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This site was really helpful in completing my timing belt on my 2004 Ody yesterday. The following are my thoughts on a few things. I gleaned some of what I thought were the best tips from others and here they are along with my own thoughts. Sorry I don't know exactly who posted them in the first place.

1. The next Honda vehicle I worked on, my Odyssey, I used an impact socket and a 15 inch 1/2" drive Craftsman breaker bar, and the starter motor. I positioned the breaker bar on the crank bolt, with the breaker bar about an inch from the (cast steel) lower control arm. Then, I just bumped (just touched) the starter switch. That did the trick, and in a few seconds, the crank bolt was off!


This worked for me with an impact socket and with the breaker bar wired into place so movement was not possible. (there were several post suggesting the motor spins the wrong direction for this to work, those posts are incorrect)


2. Marking the old belt in relation to all of the pulleys and then transferring those marks to the new belt to ensure not being a tooth off. Mark lines on all of the splined pulleys and on to the belt. Takes a total of five minutes to do this.

It doesn't hurt to be careful. This tip is great. There was no doubt in my mind that the belt was on perfectly because I was able to verify it 6 ways to Sunday. If I hadn't done this my belt would have been off a couple of teeth by the time that I got to the aft cam pulley because you have to stretch it tight. It is possible to put the belt on with the cams and the crank in the right positions but be a tooth off in one direction or the other because you didn't stretch it right. You should catch this when you rotate the engine and verify the marks, but why not just mark it and make sure from the get go. A white paint marker from NAPA worked great for this!

3. Taking the front left wheel off makes the whole process easier as it allows easy access to the crank bolt.

4. Totally remove the side engine mount. Its just in the way and its only a two minute job to get it out.

5. For me at least, getting the cam pulleys off to change bearings was not easy. I gave up on this and am going to return the seals that weren't leaking anyway (hope they don't start!).

6. I used a drill bit to hold the tensioner compressed and it bent it slightly but worked well and I didn't have to buy a tool.

This is not a bad job to do if you are mechanically inclined and have the book. BTW with my military discount at NAPA it cost me $250 including the timing belt kit, H2O pump, belt, seals, double platinum NGK plugs, and PS and Compressor Belts. Took about 8 hours, not in a rush.

Hope these tips help someone else.



Best Regards,

Clint
 

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Discussion Starter #2
Can't seem to edit previous but here the original post with some adds and changes. Clint


This site was really helpful in completing my timing belt on my 2004 Ody yesterday. The following are my thoughts on a few things. I gleaned some of what I thought were the best tips from others and here they are along with my own thoughts. Sorry I don't know exactly who posted them in the first place!

1. The next Honda vehicle I worked on, my Odyssey, I used an impact socket and a 15 inch 1/2" drive Craftsman breaker bar, and the starter motor. I positioned the breaker bar on the crank bolt, with the breaker bar about an inch from the (cast steel) lower control arm. Then, I just bumped (just touched) the starter switch. That did the trick, and in a few seconds, the crank bolt was off!


This worked for me with an impact socket and with the breaker bar wired into place so movement was not possible. (there were several post suggesting the motor spins the wrong direction for this to work, those posts are incorrect)


2. Marking the old belt in relation to all of the pulleys and then transferring those marks to the new belt to ensure not being a tooth off. Mark lines on all of the splined pulleys and on to the belt. Takes a total of five minutes to do this. To make sure all the shafts are aligned correctly and to take out much of the "I think the cam and crank are in the right spot", paint marks on the old belt(s) and all pulleys before removing the belts. Then transfer the paint marks to the new belt and install with the paint marks aligned. I'll explain:

Just before removing any toothed belt (i.e. timing belt, balancer shaft belt, etc.), paint alignment marks on the belt at each pulley - a line across the belt and onto the pulley. A white paint pen, available at craft stores, works well. On one of the pulleys, paint two lines. Also, mark the inside or outside side of the belt. After the paint drys, remove the belt(s) and then transfer the paint marks to the new belt(s), carefully lining up each tooth. Then install the new belt(s) lining up the paint marks on each pulley.


It doesn't hurt to be careful. This tip is great. There was no doubt in my mind that the belt was on perfectly because I was able to verify it 6 ways to Sunday. If I hadn't done this my belt would have been off a couple of teeth by the time that I got to the aft cam pulley because you have to stretch it tight. It is possible to put the belt on with the cams and the crank in the right positions but be a tooth off in one direction or the other because you didn't stretch it right. You should catch this when you rotate the engine and verify the marks, but why not just mark it and make sure from the get go. A white paint marker from NAPA worked great for this!

3. Taking the front left wheel off makes the whole process easier as it allows easy access to the crank bolt.

4. Totally remove the side engine mount. Its just in the way and its only a two minute job to get it out. Don't forget to support the engine (use a jack and a 2x4 under the oil pan).

5. For me at least, getting the cam pulleys off to change bearings was not easy. I gave up on this and am going to return the seals that weren't leaking anyway (hope they don't start!).

6. I used a drill bit to hold the tensioner compressed and it bent it slightly but worked well and I didn't have to buy a tool.

7. I changed the plugs at the same time. As suggested by others to make spinning the engine easier, they were the first thing out and the last thing back in. I marked the coil's 1, 2 and 3 from left to right looking at the engine with a White Out pen so I wouldn't get them mixed up. The White Out pen was great for that.

8. When the manual tells you to remove the two upper and one lower TB cover, take the upper ones off. Remove the lower cover bolts, and pull it away from the engine. Don't try to remove the cover from the vicinity of the TB until you read one or two steps ahead in the manual and remove the side engine mount bracket. That will give you plenty of space to pull the lower cover straight up and out of the engine bay.

9. When the TB is off, don't even BREATHE on the rear camshaft sprocket. If it moves more than a couple degrees, it will SNAP to 30 or more degrees, until a valve slamming into a piston stops it. If you MUST readjust it a couple degrees, do it with a decent length fixed socket handle and appropriate socket. Don't try it with a ratchet wrench. I made the mistake of trying to gently move it a couple degrees with a pair of strong hands and no wrench. I expected it to potentially try to jump, and was amazingly stupid to not look for an appropriate wrench that was 4 feet away. Because I suspected a jump, I managed to make it a controlled slam into the piston, and it doesn't seem to have caused any damage.


This is not a bad job to do if you are mechanically inclined and have the book. BTW with my military discount at NAPA it cost me $250 including the timing belt kit, H2O pump, belt, seals, double platinum NGK plugs, and PS and Compressor Belts. Took about 8 hours, not in a rush.

Hope these tips help someone else.



Best Regards,

Clint
 

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Good info, I used most of these tips when I did it. I used an allen wrench to hold the tensioner compressed.
 

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"3. Taking the front left wheel off makes the whole process easier as it allows easy access to the crank bolt."

I think you meant right/passenger side.
 

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I am preparing to do this in a few weeks. Sounds like replacing the cam seals is difficult? How about replacing the crankshaft seal?
I am trying to have everything I need before I begin so I can get it done in one day with no trips out for stuff. I have all belts, water pump, both timing belt idlers, accessory belt idler, cam and crank seals. Two of the problematic tasks seem to be compressing the tensioner and removing the crank pulley but both seem doable. Is there a seal on the tensioner that needs to be replaced? I could not find one on the parts breakdown.
 

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Only change timing belt at 50,000 miles.....

:)Ok, I am comming up to the point where based on time (not mileage) I am supposed to do the timing belt..

What I am thinking is that since I only have a little over 50,000 miles that I only do the timing belt and thats all.. I figure the rest of the components (tensioner, pulleys, water pump etc) are items that wear out based on mileage and not time. Same goes for the spark plugs which I already removed, anti seized and reinstalled..

I know all about (why not chnage it while you are in there) but this is from people who have actually gone 100,000+ miles and i plan on doing the complete component change when I hit that mileage..


Just doing the timing belt, P/S belt and AC belt I can get away with about $60 in parts...

Has anyone had any of the other components (tensioner, pulleys, water pump etc) fail before 100,000 miles???:)
 

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Discussion Starter #9
:)Ok, I am comming up to the point where based on time (not mileage) I am supposed to do the timing belt..

What I am thinking is that since I only have a little over 50,000 miles that I only do the timing belt and thats all.. I figure the rest of the components (tensioner, pulleys, water pump etc) are items that wear out based on mileage and not time. Same goes for the spark plugs which I already removed, anti seized and reinstalled..

I know all about (why not chnage it while you are in there) but this is from people who have actually gone 100,000+ miles and i plan on doing the complete component change when I hit that mileage..


Just doing the timing belt, P/S belt and AC belt I can get away with about $60 in parts...

Has anyone had any of the other components (tensioner, pulleys, water pump etc) fail before 100,000 miles???:)

My thought's are that you will be fine with your plan. Heck, at 105K my water pump showed no signs of wear, it was really tight, great bearings! The rest of my stuff was good also. Just my thoughts. (BTW, I have Toyota with 200K on the water pump, because I am cheap and handy! No problems yet) I'm sure many other people would do it all, and there's reasons for that to. But then again, if it ain't broke...
 

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I just finished this job a day ago on my 2004 as well. Here are my thoughts.

1. The starter trick works great! Removing the crank bolt was the easiest part of the job.

2. Once the timing belt is off, be VERY careful of the rear cam sprocket. It is very jumpy. This was by far the most stressful part of the job.

3. The new tensioner bearing (the one the tensioner piston pushes on) did not include the sleeve that sits on the indent on the waterpump. I missed that one and had to go back in (yes it sucked). Luckly the motor was fine.

4. binder clips are very useful to keep the new belt exactly where you want it.

5. A paint pen is great for marking the sprockets and making the timing marks easy to see.
 

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Bbylon5, to answer your question on the water pump. My 2002 oddy has 215k miles. The previous owner had the timing belt done at the dealer, but he told them not to do the water pump. This ones made it to 215k, but of course....your mileage may vary.
 

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I'm about to change my timing belt and will attemp the "starter" trick for removing the flywheel nut. However, what I haven't read yet anywhere is about re-stalling the flywheel nut without the holder. How can you get the needed torque (181 ft-lbs!) without the flywheel moving? That's like 60 pounds on the end of 3 foot pole.

Interesting that the instructions require lubricating the threads with new oil.
 

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There might be a way to stop the engine from turning while you torque the crankshaft bolt, but the easiest way is to buy the 50MM tool. I just saw it for about $15 on Amazon.com
 

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There's really no way to correctly torque it without the tool. I used the german torque guttentight with an impact, not really recommended. I would spend $15 bucks and not worry about it latter.

Clint
 

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Many auto parts stores loan out tools. My local auto parts store has the 50mm crank tool that they lend out for free.
 

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Lubricating the threads can have a major impact on torque.

I used an air gun on mine...but if an alternative may be to put some loctite on the threads instead of lubricant.
 

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Loctite on Honda crankshaft bolt threads might not be a good idea. I have read a Honda service publication for another model that mentions putting a few drops of oil on the crankshaft bolt before installing it. I presume that the oil is to prevent galvianic type corrosion between slightly different metals.

More 1999-2004 Honda Odyssey ( generation 2 ) timing belt replacement info here -
http://www.odyclub.com/forums/24-1999-2004-odyssey/154252-timing-belt-replacement.html
 

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I have read a Honda service publication for another model that mentions putting a few drops of oil on the crankshaft bolt before installing it. I presume that the oil is to prevent galvianic type corrosion between slightly different metals.
The main reason for cleaning up and oil the thread before installation is to insure proper torque regardless you are using that special crank tool with torque wrench or just torque gun, or even just extension and hammer.
 

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Thanks everyone for the suggestions and tips and now I have more to offer. I was successful with replacing the belt, water pump, and the two pulleys, starting at 6:00pm (gathering tools) and closing shop by 2 AM. The highlight of the whole job was getting the bolt off the pulley and that occurred at 7:08 pm. The rest of the job was just following the instructions. Since I didn't have the new coolant mixed, I left it to the next morning to crank the engine for the first time.

The only thing I would have done differently about the job was to purchase the pulley holder as others have already recommended. However, I had everything ready to go the Friday night and it was either pay $50 Canadian to have the tool or wait another week or two to order it for $15 from the USA. So I improvised and here's my solution. I noticed that the pulley has holes drilled into it presumably used to balance it. I then created a jig with a peg on one end to insert into one of the holes such that the rotation of the pulley would press the opposite end into the ground.

IMG_20120622_100_3_1.jpg

My first attempt was simply using a piece of 2x2 piece of lumber with a drill bit as the peg (I think a 13/64th). It would hold at the 180 ft-lbs torque but didn't think it would hold for the removal torque (testing the night before). So I added the short piece of aluminium extrusion, screw nailed to the 2x2.

IMG_20120622_102_1.jpg

A close up:
IMG_20120622_101_1.jpg

The extrusion worked out really well for the installation side of the job as the lower vehicle frame prevented a clear line from the pulley to the ground. Furthermore, I got lucky with the length of extrusion (8-7/8") as it fit perfectly into the fold of the frame so that the 2x2 wasn't even needed (but didn't get in the way either). Shorter might have worked too but not longer. Very important to note that the aluminium extrusion must be flush up against the pulley with the peg (drill bit) stuck in as much as possible. This will maximize the shear strength and minimize the bending action on the drill bit.

But what a crack that bolt made when it finally let go and I was very relieved that it wasn't something broken. It took a 6 foot pole on the breaker bar handle to do the job. The recommended cleaning and oil of the bolt on re-installation is a must. I forgot at first and the torque wrench would jump as the bolt tighten. With the oil, the bolt smoothly rotated to the needed torque.
 
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