Transmission Survey + 9/10 speed detailed info (One thread to rule them all)
42588
154
NOT REPORTED IN THE SURVEY /\
[9 speed failures: 2]
[10 Speed failures: 9]
Not trying to beat this into the ground...just trying to be informative to the community and those that might be experiencing issues. Feel like this should've been created back in 2017/18. On top of that there are so many threads on specifically the 9 speed it can be confusing.
Things to note: 9 Speed is designed by ZF Friedrichshafen Germany, made in South Carolina USA. The 10 speed is designed by Honda in Japan, made in Georgia USA.
Goal of both AT is to save fuel. On average they are fairly the same in MPG. However, they behave differently due to the design. Traditionally AT uses friction clutches resulting in some slip which means transitioning form one gear to another is smooth. 10 Speed is designed as such. 9 Speed on the other hand uses dog clutches between 4-5 and 7-8th gear shifts where no slip can take place, these gears have to in perfect sync for them to mesh together. This results in delayed shifting, a click noise.
ZF 9HP (9 speed)
This AT is notorious and has a pretty bad track record from when it was originally introduced in early Chrysler models. Lots of TLX (2015) Pilot (2016-17) Including MDX had serious issues. Many got their AT replaced. Acura even extended warranties to 10 years on the newly installed AT. ZF blamed most of these issues to how the transmission was programed causing drama. lot of failures with 9HP in the early Pilots and MDX are due to coolant and ATF mixing. This has been addressed at h/w level and with extended warranties. 2019+ has other internal h/w improvements.
This is AT is used still in MDX, Pilot, Passport, Ridgeline in the honda/acura family as of now. Again lots of complaints from the 2016-2017.
On the recent models... overall 99%+ complaints are about shift quality, particularly from 4-5 & 7-8 up/downshifts. This is due to the dog clutch mentioned above. It’s different and takes a little getting used to. ZF for some reason made this into a learning AT. This transmission "learns" how you drive. So Imagine if you have 2+ drivers in the house. ZF even blamed this unpredictable behavior on the customers Link.
TOWING:
ZF 9HP specs are great on paper. Technically it's a bit over built for the Honda J series v6.
Total weight: (wet) 90 Kg / 198.42 lbs
Max torque rating: 500 Nm / 368.7811 ft lbs
(Odyssey: 262 ft lbs)
Even with the great specs Odysseys with the ZF can only tow 3000 lbs.
This may have to do with cooling the unit, Honda never bothered to make this official.
Part:
ATF Cooler Kit (9-Speed AWD)
Instructions for pilot:
https://www.collegehillshonda.com/instructions/pilot/2021/5ezcooler.pdf
It should work on the Ody but the mount points and path for running lines will not exist on the van as is on the pilot or other Honda/Acura's
MAINTENANCE:
The fluid replacement process on the ZF is a chore and unnecessarily convoluted. Expect to pay $350 or more at the dealer. Fluid prices have gone down form $50 to ~$25
for Honda ATF-TYPE 3.1. FYI, it does have a fill bolt on the top and is quite accessible.
To put this thing on neutral without battery you need a key tool (07AAA-TZ3A100) $200. This is also very accessible from the top. (Honda used to just have simple a shift lock back in the day)
Chrysler Pacifica so far is the only vehicle that have tamed this transmission working directly with ZF. Unfortunately Honda is not there yet. Small effort was made with a Service Bulletin19-124.
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Honda 10AT (10 speed)
This is the future. Most folks report this AT is very smooth and trouble free but there are issues and several failures reported here. This is expected with a brand new product. The 10AT fairly new still so it may or may not have issues. What’s for certain is that even this 10AT will continue to be refined as it gets more application over time. (Personal history, I've never had any issues with most Honda transmissions from the early 90's to now. My parents 03 Ody had 1 transmision replaced at 160k miles. See my list of vehicles)
TOWING:
With the 10AT the Ody can tow full 3500 lbs. No cooler needed. It would be interesting to see if coolers appear on the market when MDX + Pilot switch over this this AT.
Total weight: 220lbs
Max torque rating: 280ft-lbs-354ft-lbs (range form other acuras)
(Odyssey: 262 ft lbs)
MAINTENANCE:
The fluid replacement process is much cheaper/simpler on this AT. Honda ATF-TYPE 2.
The Fill bolt is in the front and faces the radiator and uses a typical 17mm, 6-point head. It is accessible from the engine bay, preferably from the bottom. The drain is the typical 3/8" style. Here is a DIY from smufguy >> DIY - 10spd ATF change
To put this thing on neutral without battery you need to remove the front cover, intake tube, battery and then you need to use an open-end wrench. (Honda used to just have simple a shift lock back in the day)
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No one knows the longevity of the 5th Gen Odyssey. Everything is new and we don’t have any long term usage/mileage to report back. As mentioned 9 speed's primary complaint is shift quality, specifically dog clutches. Not many all out failures reported here. The 10 speed is preferred, shifts much smoother but has several failures reported here. The numbers are too low to mean anything atm. YMMV.
Admins, would love to have this pinned. If this is useless please get rid of it.
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Honda 10AT (10 speed) fails: 9 reported
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(2 failures ^here^)
Honda 10AT (10 speed) issues
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ZF 9HP (9 speed) fails: 2 reported
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ZF 9HP (9 speed) issues
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I'm sure there are more...
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**These are sealed units. AT gets replaced as an entire unit, Dealers do not take these apart. (Please correct me if I am wrong)
[9 speed failures: 2]
[10 Speed failures: 9]
Not trying to beat this into the ground...just trying to be informative to the community and those that might be experiencing issues. Feel like this should've been created back in 2017/18. On top of that there are so many threads on specifically the 9 speed it can be confusing.
Things to note: 9 Speed is designed by ZF Friedrichshafen Germany, made in South Carolina USA. The 10 speed is designed by Honda in Japan, made in Georgia USA.
Goal of both AT is to save fuel. On average they are fairly the same in MPG. However, they behave differently due to the design. Traditionally AT uses friction clutches resulting in some slip which means transitioning form one gear to another is smooth. 10 Speed is designed as such. 9 Speed on the other hand uses dog clutches between 4-5 and 7-8th gear shifts where no slip can take place, these gears have to in perfect sync for them to mesh together. This results in delayed shifting, a click noise.
ZF 9HP (9 speed)
This AT is notorious and has a pretty bad track record from when it was originally introduced in early Chrysler models. Lots of TLX (2015) Pilot (2016-17) Including MDX had serious issues. Many got their AT replaced. Acura even extended warranties to 10 years on the newly installed AT. ZF blamed most of these issues to how the transmission was programed causing drama. lot of failures with 9HP in the early Pilots and MDX are due to coolant and ATF mixing. This has been addressed at h/w level and with extended warranties. 2019+ has other internal h/w improvements.
This is AT is used still in MDX, Pilot, Passport, Ridgeline in the honda/acura family as of now. Again lots of complaints from the 2016-2017.
On the recent models... overall 99%+ complaints are about shift quality, particularly from 4-5 & 7-8 up/downshifts. This is due to the dog clutch mentioned above. It’s different and takes a little getting used to. ZF for some reason made this into a learning AT. This transmission "learns" how you drive. So Imagine if you have 2+ drivers in the house. ZF even blamed this unpredictable behavior on the customers Link.
TOWING:
ZF 9HP specs are great on paper. Technically it's a bit over built for the Honda J series v6.
Total weight: (wet) 90 Kg / 198.42 lbs
Max torque rating: 500 Nm / 368.7811 ft lbs
(Odyssey: 262 ft lbs)
Even with the great specs Odysseys with the ZF can only tow 3000 lbs.
This may have to do with cooling the unit, Honda never bothered to make this official.
Part:
ATF Cooler Kit (9-Speed AWD)
Instructions for pilot:
https://www.collegehillshonda.com/instructions/pilot/2021/5ezcooler.pdf
It should work on the Ody but the mount points and path for running lines will not exist on the van as is on the pilot or other Honda/Acura's
MAINTENANCE:
The fluid replacement process on the ZF is a chore and unnecessarily convoluted. Expect to pay $350 or more at the dealer. Fluid prices have gone down form $50 to ~$25
for Honda ATF-TYPE 3.1. FYI, it does have a fill bolt on the top and is quite accessible.
To put this thing on neutral without battery you need a key tool (07AAA-TZ3A100) $200. This is also very accessible from the top. (Honda used to just have simple a shift lock back in the day)
Chrysler Pacifica so far is the only vehicle that have tamed this transmission working directly with ZF. Unfortunately Honda is not there yet. Small effort was made with a Service Bulletin19-124.
---
Honda 10AT (10 speed)
This is the future. Most folks report this AT is very smooth and trouble free but there are issues and several failures reported here. This is expected with a brand new product. The 10AT fairly new still so it may or may not have issues. What’s for certain is that even this 10AT will continue to be refined as it gets more application over time. (Personal history, I've never had any issues with most Honda transmissions from the early 90's to now. My parents 03 Ody had 1 transmision replaced at 160k miles. See my list of vehicles)
TOWING:
With the 10AT the Ody can tow full 3500 lbs. No cooler needed. It would be interesting to see if coolers appear on the market when MDX + Pilot switch over this this AT.
Total weight: 220lbs
Max torque rating: 280ft-lbs-354ft-lbs (range form other acuras)
(Odyssey: 262 ft lbs)
MAINTENANCE:
The fluid replacement process is much cheaper/simpler on this AT. Honda ATF-TYPE 2.
The Fill bolt is in the front and faces the radiator and uses a typical 17mm, 6-point head. It is accessible from the engine bay, preferably from the bottom. The drain is the typical 3/8" style. Here is a DIY from smufguy >> DIY - 10spd ATF change
To put this thing on neutral without battery you need to remove the front cover, intake tube, battery and then you need to use an open-end wrench. (Honda used to just have simple a shift lock back in the day)
--------------
No one knows the longevity of the 5th Gen Odyssey. Everything is new and we don’t have any long term usage/mileage to report back. As mentioned 9 speed's primary complaint is shift quality, specifically dog clutches. Not many all out failures reported here. The 10 speed is preferred, shifts much smoother but has several failures reported here. The numbers are too low to mean anything atm. YMMV.
Admins, would love to have this pinned. If this is useless please get rid of it.
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Honda 10AT (10 speed) fails: 9 reported
How is the 10 speed transmission holding up?
Yes, my 2022 Odyssey with 300 miles on it just started falling out of gear randomly. Dealer said it needs a transmission replacement. As you can imagine, Im not happy and wish we could just get rid of it now
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2022 Transmission Problems
Have a 2022 Odyssey with under 1500 miles. Recently while driving on the interstate, we ran into transmission problems. The gears started slipping and car was driving in neutral on the highway and was not accelerating. All warning lights for safety sensors came on. Honda ended up replacing the...
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2020 EX-L 10 Speed Transmission Failure at 11k miles
I had mentioned this in a previous thread, but I figured I would start a new one so people searching in the future might be able to find it better with search. 2020 EX-L with 11021 miles. We had no transmission issues before this point. My wife left for work (back out of driveway, go down a...
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My 2018 Elite is getting a new transmission
Thankful for the warranty. Last summer, a couple of times my car would not go into reverse, it would blink transmission system error and blind spot error. If you restarted the car it would reverse.... It did not do it at the Honda Dealership... as soon as I put the A/C on this spring it...
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2018 Touring - 10 Speed Auto - Failure
Just wanted to share an odd situation. A week ago my 12,000km old van started to exhibit odd shifting behavior in around gears 3/4/5, where the upshifts were a bit harsh, and the downshifts were a bit abrupt. 2 days ago, noticed that the tranny started smack gears and then yesterday i found...
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10 speed transmission failed
2018 Odyssey Touring At 50700 kms or 31687 miles I need a new transmission!!!! Anyone else having similar problems?
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2018 touring transmission failure?
My touring is having issues with the transmission. Shifting hard through gears, jerking when it does shift. Now on numerous ocassions when you place the car into reverse it will not reverse, the engine will just rev high like you were in park. When it does this the screen will flash transmission...
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Honda 10AT (10 speed) issues
10 speed transmission rough downshifting
Does anyone with the 10 speed transmission touring/elite trims notice that you can feel the downshifting at slow speeds? I can really notice the 2nd to 1st gear downshift almost feels like a manual sometimes.
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10 Speed Transmission Surging
I have a 2018 Touring Elite with 25,000 miles and the 10-speed transmission. Recently, it is surging at the beginning of the first drive of the day for about the first 5 minutes at low speeds. I can watch the RPM pulse from around 1500 to 2000 when it is happening and I would say it's around...
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10 Speed Transmission Stuck in first gear
When I back out of my garage and down my relatively steep driveway onto my sloped street, my transmission is stuck in first gear. I only have about 150 feet to the stop sign at the end of the street, but it won't shift no matter how much gas I give it. I've hit upwards of 4000 RPMs. I'd say...
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ZF 9HP (9 speed) fails: 2 reported
2018 EXL.....transmission failure at 5,634 miles
I bought an EXL model back in June 2018. Last Tuesday, it started driving sluggishly, and my screen flashed several failure messages incuding transmission emissions failure. I managed to get it to the dealership and was reassured it probably WASN'T the transmission. Several hours later, they...
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ALERT ! 2018 Odyssey Transmission Failure at 75,400 miles !
I knew this was going to happen; Honda decided to "re-engineer" the transmission for the 2018 Honda Odyssey, and it's going to be a HUGE HEADACHE for the company in the near future.. and even bigger for owners! I have owned a 2007, 2011, 2014, and now, a 2018 Honda Odyssey. I drive an average...
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ZF 9HP (9 speed) issues
Transmission computer malfunction
At less than 3,000 miles, we went over a speed bump, the transmission shifted to neutral and the engine shut off. It was towed to the service center but could not find anything wrong. A tech hooked up a computer and took it to his home. It came out the transmission computer was defective and it...
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2018 odyssey transmission
Well much to my discuss my 2018 ody transmission is making the clunking sounds with 64347 miles and my mechanic has sent me to a transmission guy. I have never liked this car I loved my 2007 that is still going strong with a little less than 300000 miles. I am going to be so mad if this car...
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9 Speed Transmission Issues
I just replaced my 2015 Honda Odyssey with a 2018. The 2015 drove smooth as butter and I never had any issues with the transmission. The 2018's transmission is very jerky and unpredictable. Going from 0 - 25ish it shifts hard several times. At about 35+ it drives normal. It seems the colder the...
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What's the verdict on the 9 speed transmission?
I've read a lot of complaints about the ZF 9 speed transmission in other vehicles such as Chrysler and the Pilot, but I don't see a lot of complaints here. So for those of you that have been driving the 9 speed in the '18 Ody for awhile, how do you like it?
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2018 EX 9-speed transmission software update
Hi team, It's been about two weeks since my Honda dealer updated my 9-speed software. I just wanted to report that the shifting is much better. There is still a slight hesitation when accelerating for the first time after a cold start but not as bad as before. The shifting within the dog...
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2018 Odyssey EX - Transmission Slipping
Hey Folks, New to the forum. Did a search for a similar issue before posting, but couldn't find anything that seemed to match my issue. If this is addressed on another thread I apologize and please point me to the thread. My transmission seems to be "slipping". When starting from a stop...
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2018 Odyssey Transmission
Ok guys I have turned 34,000 miles on my 2018. The transmission jumps when up shifting or down shifting during 23 to 28 mph steady driving range. This happens usually in metro area traffic not at take off. I have only have this van to Honda for service. I had the transmission flushed at the...
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9 speed transmission longevity
While by no means this is an accurate statistic of the 9-speed ZF transmission's reliability.... I've seen multiple threads here of people reporting their Honda-built 10-speed going out and had to be replaced and have only seen one thread for the 9-speed. Again, this does not indicate much...
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9 Speed Transmission Issues
I just replaced my 2015 Honda Odyssey with a 2018. The 2015 drove smooth as butter and I never had any issues with the transmission. The 2018's transmission is very jerky and unpredictable. Going from 0 - 25ish it shifts hard several times. At about 35+ it drives normal. It seems the colder the...
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Any happy 2018-19 9 speed transmission (ZF 9HP) long...
Ok so ZF9 hasn't had the best reputation around here. Are there folks out there with ZF9 that are happy with the purchase and hasn't had any issues? No regrets? I want to hear from you. I have a 2019 EX-L 9AT. It's a lot smoother now after 3k miles. I thought I had made a huge mistake at first.
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**These are sealed units. AT gets replaced as an entire unit, Dealers do not take these apart. (Please correct me if I am wrong)
