[Da Hapa]

Interesting thread. Bottom line seems to be that eliminating the ability to remove the center seat and slide the other two together like in the older Odysseys was a big boo-boo that will hopefully be fixed soon.

I don't know that I agree. While I am not diminishing what Artiesmana is saying, I think there are an awful lot of owners here like me that are very happy with the trade off provided with the redesign.

 

[ody_60613]

I own a 2012 EX-L. I have 19 month old twins. I purchased two radian RXT's and I purchased the angle adjuster accessory. I am able to place both car seats side by side (middle and outboard). I am able to use LATCH on both seats. Installing the angle adjuster on the middle seat allows the seat base to slip into fold of the middle seat. This is rear facing installation for both seats.


That leaves the other outboard seat free to use or slide forward to allow access to the 3rd row. So I don't see the loss of sliding the captains chairs together a big deal.

 

[YinzerMama]

I don't know that I agree. While I am not diminishing what Artiesmana is saying, I think there are an awful lot of owners here like me that are very happy with the trade off provided with the redesign.

The thing is though they could have kept this feature even with the redesign.

What I found, compared to my old Sienna, was that instead of 3 OK seats across the middle, I now have 2 awesome seats and one "it'll do" seat. If that middle seat was wider (fill the wide mode gap, get ride of wide mode) and maybe shaped (like the outboard seats, vs flat), you'd have 2 awesome and 1 OK seats. You could remove one and have a side aisle if wanted, even without having a child seat in the middle. (This is a really nice option to have on a trip if you have things that won't fit in the cargo area.

OR if the outboard seat could slide over still so even without armrests you'd still have two good seats and an aisle to the back.

Like I've said the way it is now works for us, but it could be better. If you have kids and use the 3rd row every day, it's nice to have access to the back row that doesn't require moving a seat every time or losing functionality of the 3rd row. Also if you actually wanted 3 people to sit in the middle row all the time, or even for one long trip, not in child seats, making that middle seat better would make the car much better without detracting anything.

So either make the middle seat as wide as possible, or bring back the ability to slide an outboard seat over. It would just make a great car even better. I like how the center seat is improved vs. the old generation, but they didn't have to take features away to add this feature. I guess that's the bottom line here.

Compared to any other NEW minivan, the new Ody is the king (imo). But the last generation of both ody and sienna are seriously holding their value, and I think the family friendliness of the 2nd row has something to do with that. Just the tiniest little tweak here would make for a huge improvement. (Personally I lean towards further improving the center seat)

 

[ody_60613]

Prior to purchasing, I rented a 4th gen odyssey. Used it for a road trip seating 7 adults (2 + 3 + 2). From Illinois to Colorado. Not once did any person find the middle seat uncomfortable.


Sent from my iPhone using AutoGuide.com Free App

 

[BigBoat]

Why not remove the driver's side captain's chair completely? Move the passenger captain's chair into "wide mode" so there is more space between it and the 2nd row middle seat. Install the 2 carseats in the passenger captains chair and the middle 2nd row. Now you have room for diaper changes, bin for winter clothes an 3 year old in middle can't open the door with his foot. 3rd kid in booster walks right into the back and straps in.

Yes, good option. I might be missing something, but I don't understand why the handicap of the "new" configuration compared to the earlier gen for little kids in car seats (main purpose of the van in my case). The middle seat even has latches and tether. I have a Britax Frontier 85 for the oldest on the middle seat, and it actually comes with its own armrests and cupholders. I have 3 car seats on the 2nd row and it has been set in 3 different configurations for the last 2 years as needed. To top, my folks are in town so I have them accessing the 3rd row like in the pic, by tilting the captain chair (with car seat installed). I realized that taking the headrest off actually allows you to further tilt, even better. Not perfect but so far I have not hit a wall yet. Ingress and egress is so quick and easy and I have tons of cargo space when the 3rd row is not needed.

As per the wide mode vs non-wide, not used it yet with no car seats, but I've seen that the captain chairs are too close to the door for adult comfort on wide-mode, it may help gaining a couple of inches back if the wide-mode is not really needed. I might be wrong though.

 

[1tufgt]

LOL @ BigBoat, that's the same way I allow access to our 3rd row. Not sure if it was intentionally designed that way but it works. I haven't removed the headrest though, might need to try that.

 

[artiesmana]

Why not remove the driver's side captain's chair completely? Move the passenger captain's chair into "wide mode" so there is more space between it and the 2nd row middle seat. Install the 2 carseats in the passenger captains chair and the middle 2nd row. Now you have room for diaper changes, bin for winter clothes an 3 year old in middle can't open the door with his foot. 3rd kid in booster walks right into the back and straps in.

If I do this, it's a down-grade from what I had before. There's not "more space" in between the 2nd row middle seat even when in the wide mode when you are comparing this configuration with the 2 captains chairs next to each other in the old van. Why am I paying hundreds of dollars a month so that my kids can be more crammed together and not have arm rests anymore? Before one of the seats was bigger and they were significantly more spaced apart since there were 2 arm rests in between. The wide mode provides like an inch and half extra space vs the space of 2 arm rests plus the extra space provided by a bigger seat with 2 captain's chairs). Also, as I mentioned, with the kids being crammed together in that configuration in the new van, they are fighting way more since my little one more easily reach his brother. He actually rests his foot on his brother's seat. He used to do this before but it was his own seat. Now because his seat is smaller, there's no room on the sides of his child seat and foot ends up on his brother's seat. I wasn't kidding when I said that even in the wide mode, his brother's child seat is literally overlapping his brother's seat. We do have the most narrow child seat I know of but it still overlaps the other seat, even in wide-mode.

 

[artiesmana]

Yes, good option. I might be missing something, but I don't understand why the handicap of the "new" configuration compared to the earlier gen for little kids in car seats (main purpose of the van in my case). The middle seat even has latches and tether. I have a Britax Frontier 85 for the oldest on the middle seat, and it actually comes with its own armrests and cupholders. I have 3 car seats on the 2nd row and it has been set in 3 different configurations for the last 2 years as needed. To top, my folks are in town so I have them accessing the 3rd row like in the pic, by tilting the captain chair (with car seat installed). I realized that taking the headrest off actually allows you to further tilt, even better. Not perfect but so far I have not hit a wall yet. Ingress and egress is so quick and easy and I have tons of cargo space when the 3rd row is not needed.

As per the wide mode vs non-wide, not used it yet with no car seats, but I've seen that the captain chairs are too close to the door for adult comfort on wide-mode, it may help gaining a couple of inches back if the wide-mode is not really needed. I might be wrong though.

I must not be doing a good job of explaining the handicap. I don't have nor do I want 3 child seats in the middle row. The handicap is that you can no longer remove the center seat and slide one of the other seats over. When you could do that before, it allowed 2 people to have 2 arm rests each (instead of only one) and more space in between each other while still allowing room on the side for getting through, changing diapers, etc. Also allowed for a storage bin to be placed on the floor in the center row without obstructing traffic to the back. I'll likely never need 3 child seats in the middle. I have 3 kids and hoping for more but I don't have them super close together. My oldest is already out of his child seat and my middle is nearly there too.

 

[BigBoat]

LOL @ BigBoat, that's the same way I allow access to our 3rd row. Not sure if it was intentionally designed that way but it works. I haven't removed the headrest though, might need to try that.

My guess is that it was not designed like that, but oh well . I've tried the liftgate access too, but it's a pain, especially with cargo

 

[BigBoat]

I must not be doing a good job of explaining the handicap.

That is why I posted pictures, it really helps. People may be able to give you more effective feedback to your problem. I guess trading the car is out of the question already

And no, my kids are not super close together either

 

[artiesmana]

I think you just get used to what you have and it throws you for a tailspin to have to adjust.

We got the 8 passenger Sienna when I was pregnant with my twins specifically because I wanted all 3 in one row. I figured if we had 2 captains chairs and someone had to sit in the back, the kids would fight over who got the comfortable seat and who got shafted in the back. So this way they were all equally un/comfortable! My oldest was still in a car seat at the time so we put 3 across the middle and it was fine. Never even thought about armrests since, coming from a sedan, it wasn't something we were giving up. I never felt weird having a van with all the kids i the middle row since then I had the whole back for diaper changes, double stroller, costco run, whatever. It worked out great for us. The seats in the old Sienna tumbled forward rather than slide which is super easy and put the seat out of the way without removing it, so once we had kid #4 we could easily throw open the space to the back (passenger outboard), have 2 in the middle, 2 in the back. Worked great. But we had a leak in that van that drove me batty for 2 years and we finally gave up and moved on.

I had ruled out the Ody when we bought the old Sienna because the 8th seat for the Ody was lousy compared to the Sienna. The new Ody was close-ish to the old Sienna and I jumped on that fact, without noticing small things that drove me nuts once I got home. Such as what is up with the 3rd row windows not opening??? I didn't check that at the dealer because why wouldn't they??? I thought every van did. I didn't realize the seats slid vs tumbled - I assumed all seats tumbled! I was positively batty with how much I hated this car. I just couldn't do with it what I did with the old one. I hated to actually REMOVE an outboard seat because then why bother having bought an 8 person van??? If I left it in though I didn't have a spot for diaper changes and I can't trust my girls to put the seat back when they climb back there and if they don't do it right it slides around when I drive. I finally gave in and removed it. And it works. I can't fit 8 but if I need to fit another person in without warning I can move one of the girls' seats from the 3rd row to where my son normally sits and then fit 2 un-car-seated passengers in the 3rd row along with a car seat. Tight, but works. With the old Sienna I couldn't easily fit a person between the girls' 2 frontiers so I really have about the same amount of people space as I did then, if I didn't move a seat. It's not the same but I have figured out how to make it work.

We didn't even consider used with our new car because I was afraid of getting another problem vehicle with no warranty (I didn't know you can get extended warranties and so forth on used cars). Had I known you can put the captain's chairs side by side in the old Ody and take the 8th seat out - it would have been something to consider. I didn't know you could do this, though. I wouldn't have the awesome tethers in the 3rd row that the new has though... so...

Anyway. We have a Britax marathon in the middle. I think my oldest kind of uses it as his armrest. I had considered a radian because they have more legroom but I don't want to have to use a seat belt to install and it seems that works best to rf the radian? So we're sticking with the marathon until it expires. Maybe a different car seat in the middle would solve your problems?

How old is the child in the back? Can you leave the middle seat in so there is an armrest but have whoever sits in the back just move the seat each time? (Or if that seat is on the driver's side maybe move it yourself?)

Two kids in car seats in the middle, and put the oldest back in a booster in the back if he needs it?

I've pretty much worked around the differences for us. I even went and drove an old Sienna 8 passenger which still had original warranty left on it and we could have extended that even more - but couldn't commit to it. I've come to really like certain things about the Ody. I still have a soft spot for the old Sienna but have come to see the new ody not as better or worse, just different. I think that over the long haul it will be a better choice for us as the kids get older - the 3rd row is REALLY comfy for an adult so no one will be smashed back there. I don't know how it compares to the old ody though. We're done with 4 and I think this car seats 4 kids perfectly and allows a few more to be squeezed in if needed.

It's been kind of like moving to a new house and suddenly the waffle iron and crock pot can't fit in the same cabinet, you freak out, then you arrange to suit and get used to it and forget how it ever was in your old house.

I know too well that feeling of "Oh crap why did I buy this car" - and the old ones are really holding their value so it seems crazy to trade in the new for an old one. Siennas are more reasonable in price but hard to find 8 seats and I don't know what features you like in your car - the 8 seaters are VERY basic.

I hope you come around to like the new car. But taking out the putting two seats together was a silly thing to remove. The middle seat should either be bigger or you should be able to move the outer seat in - even without armrests enough room for your butt is a nice thing!

Write to Honda and tell them. If enough people point out that they miss this feature maybe they will bring it back.

American Honda Motor Co., Inc.
Honda Automobile Customer Service
1919 Torrance Boulevard
Mail Stop: 500 - 2N - 7A
Torrance, CA 90501-2746

Yes, this is exactly it. I just got so used to what I had and I'm just having trouble adjusting but it's definitely getting better. I had that terrible regret feeling. We never planned to buy a new van. Our neighbor bought a new Sienna last week and we were checking theirs out. I casually mentioned the idea of trading ours in for a new one while it's still worth a lot. Our neighbor only got $1000 trading heir old van b/c it was so old. I asked my husband how much he thought it would be so he went to the dealership to ask. That's when we found out they didn't have the same model anymore. Our 09 was an EX-L with DVD and Nav. But now you have to choose one or the other. So to get both, we'd have to go up to a Touring and that was going to be a lot more than I wanted to spend. So I suggested going over to Toyota and checking out the Siennas. He comes home with a Buyer's order for a new Sienna and we got an amazing deal on it. My husband is a very good haggler, lol. Any who, the only reason he didn't come home with it that night was because they didn't have the one we wanted so they were going to have to have one brought in. Thank God, because that night I read about how you can't slide the seats in the middle row over like our Ody so I panicked and dh backed out of the deal.

So back over to Honda he goes and it just seemed like there were a lot of bumps in the purchasing. We still ended up with an amazing deal but more than I was hoping to spend. And I was there when the salesman assured us that you can slide the seats over like wanted. Then dh calls me back to break the news that you can't. He tried and said it's close, you can almost do it but it won't quite reach. It's just been hard for me to accept. I don't deal well with change apparently, lol.

But any way, we have the middle seat out and hopefully it will grow on me. I'm trying to look at the bright sides. We haven't had much practice with it yet. We only bought it 2 or 3 days ago but they put a dent in the door when they were installing the roof rack so we are driving a loaner Pilot while it's in the shop. I have to say, the Pilot is less convenient than the new Ody so that should help me love the van more when we get it back .

 

[YinzerMama]

Prior to purchasing, I rented a 4th gen odyssey. Used it for a road trip seating 7 adults (2 + 3 + 2). From Illinois to Colorado. Not once did any person find the middle seat uncomfortable.


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It's not horrible with the whole middle "bench" assembled, but if I didn't have to sit somewhere there, I don't think I would. The 2 side seats are way comfier. And if you don't have the whole row assembled, the middle seat is much less than stellar.

Whether you miss or don't miss the ability to have just two seats and a dedicated, ideally side, aisle in the car, it is a feature a lot of people liked in the old vans. If you research minivans on mom or car seat forums, it comes up a lot. It's not some quirk that only a few people liked. And there's no reason they can't have kept that with the new car. Wider middle seat, or ability to move outside chair over.

 

[YinzerMama]

Here's my car. Works great for now. The biggest problem with this is Honda's 40 pound latch limit, and if I use a seatbelt to install the seat, the girl in the rear driver's side pocket complains that she can't see the DVD player. So once the baby passes 40 pounds, I will move him to the passenger side seat. It's not as nice as the old car because I really miss having that passenger seat on hand but out of the way (it tumbled) BUT on the other hand the two outboard seats are more comfortable than the old car and the center console in the new car is actually useful for something. In the Sienna the center seat had a flat plastic part with two shallow circles on it that looked like they were thinking about giving you cup holders but got distracted halfway through.

Maybe try harder to get a good install on your child seat in the middle? I have never tried to install that seat so I can't speak from experience.

I never even considered the new Toyota. I think they lost their minds when they redesigned it. There's no workaround at all in that car to have the set up I am used to. There is only one top tether in the back row. The tracks in the floor are ugly. I don't know what they were thinking. Whatever regrets I had over the Ody, I don't wish I had a new Sienna.

 

[artiesmana]

The other reason we don't' want to take one of the big seats out is that we really don't have any good place to store it. It's a little easier to store the middle seat since it's smaller. We have to store it in the garage and I do worry that something will happen to it in there. But if it gets damaged, it will be a lot cheaper to replace the middle seat vs one of the big seats. I really like that the Sienna allows you to store the middle seat in the van. Another thing I don't like is that there are no mats that cover up the holes/hooks in the ground for the new model. Our old Ody had mats to cover them. We tried to buy some but they don't even make any for the new van.

 

[BigBoat]

The other reason we don't' want to take one of the big seats out is that we really don't have any good place to store it. It's a little easier to store the middle seat since it's smaller. We have to store it in the garage and I do worry that something will happen to it in there. But if it gets damaged, it will be a lot cheaper to replace the middle seat vs one of the big seats. I really like that the Sienna allows you to store the middle seat in the van. Another thing I don't like is that there are no mats that cover up the holes/hooks in the ground for the new model. Our old Ody had mats to cover them. We tried to buy some but they don't even make any for the new van.

Oh man, I would not like to be in your DH shoes . You seemed to have very specific requirements and he did not do enough research on the car model changes. I had a similar problem with a laptop once, needed a new one so I just browsed through the next gen specs of the same brand and ordered online. The audio buttons and ports layout ended up being all messed up. They even changed the power supply plug, so several of my accessories went

 

[YinzerMama]

Artiesmana I swear we should be bff's on facebook. I seriously could have divorced my husband when I realized the stroller no longer lay flat in the trunk. He measured with his arm and thought the trunks were "about the same." He talked me out of taking our bike trailer to the dealer to really objectively figure things out.

You have no idea how crazy I was with my hate for this car when we got it.

Add to this the dealer we traded in at turns out to be the shadiest dealer this side of the Mississippi. Baeirl. They are HUGE in sw PA. I am amazed that anyone could be so dishonest and shady and rotten.

As far as the holes in the floor - go buy a nice bathmat from Target. Add a little color AND it is machine washable. (my old Sienna mats I could machine wash - I will miss that)

If you don't miss the diaper spot - you CAN push the seat forward and make the back lie flat, so in and out to the back is not bad. It takes some fiddling but you can do it. I don't do car diaper changes in the winter anyway. My husband is out right now with all the kids - I am supposed to be sewing pillow cases for gifts - so I can't go to figure the exact steps to get back to you. But its an option.

But seriously. I hated. Hated. HATED this car when we got it. Hated it like "work long hours because I'd rather eat glass than face my wife right now" hated it. But the damn thing has grown on me... and I actually really like it now.

 

[YinzerMama]

(I am, of course, exaggerating somewhat... I wouldn't actually get divorced over the trunk size. But I swear. My hatred of this car was epic. Truly epic. But I like it now. Quite a lot.)

 

[artiesmana]

Oh man, I would not like to be in your DH shoes . You seemed to have very specific requirements and he did not do enough research on the car model changes. I had a similar problem with a laptop once, needed a new one so I just browsed through the next gen specs of the same brand and ordered online. The audio buttons and ports layout ended up being all messed up. They even changed the power supply plug, so several of my accessories went

I do feel badly for my husband, having to deal with my initial disappointment. We usually research things thoroughly but we weren't planning on buying -- just getting an estimate. Buying our first Ody was his baby, his research project. Any who, the 'specific requirements' that you quoted above were actually all his wants, not so much mine. He was the one who vetoed the idea of taking out the big seat for the reasons listed. He was the one that tried to get the floor mats. I hadn't even noticed since I was too upset about not being able to slide the seats together, ha ha. But yeah, my sweet dh -- God love him! He puts up with me. He knows that I don't do well with change. I'm so thankful for him .

 

[artiesmana]

Artiesmana I swear we should be bff's on facebook. I seriously could have divorced my husband when I realized the stroller no longer lay flat in the trunk. He measured with his arm and thought the trunks were "about the same." He talked me out of taking our bike trailer to the dealer to really objectively figure things out.

You have no idea how crazy I was with my hate for this car when we got it.

Add to this the dealer we traded in at turns out to be the shadiest dealer this side of the Mississippi. Baeirl. They are HUGE in sw PA. I am amazed that anyone could be so dishonest and shady and rotten.

As far as the holes in the floor - go buy a nice bathmat from Target. Add a little color AND it is machine washable. (my old Sienna mats I could machine wash - I will miss that)

If you don't miss the diaper spot - you CAN push the seat forward and make the back lie flat, so in and out to the back is not bad. It takes some fiddling but you can do it. I don't do car diaper changes in the winter anyway. My husband is out right now with all the kids - I am supposed to be sewing pillow cases for gifts - so I can't go to figure the exact steps to get back to you. But its an option.

But seriously. I hated. Hated. HATED this car when we got it. Hated it like "work long hours because I'd rather eat glass than face my wife right now" hated it. But the damn thing has grown on me... and I actually really like it now.

Ha ha, I can't tell you how reassuring it is to know that someone else had an epic hatred at first. I felt really guilty about hating it. I mean, who hates a brand new van? Spoiled brats?! It's hard when you try to make sure certain things will work in advance and then it turns out that it won't. Hard for people who have a harder time adjusting to change than others, ha. Definitely feeling more positive about the van now. It's good to hear the option to push the seat forward and make the back lie flat. I think that will work well for us. Phew! I think I'm really liking it now too!